Science Forums - View Single Post - Terra Preta

Michaelangelica · 05-05-2006

I was wandering arround the Permaculture forums and came accross this post which is interesting.
You should vist the site if you are into useful plants and gardening. It's great
SEE:
http://forums.permaculture.org.au/vi...?p=18201#18201

Re: Terra Preta What is the fuction of the clay pottery shards?

"PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2006 11:26 pm
On reading about the actual terra preta mix and process there are a lot of questions about the presence of clay shards. I havent even read any speculation as to why they are there.
Two, things spring to mind.

Firstly, the ancients may have been carting this soil to other areas or water to that site but woven baskets would have been more feasible for the soil.

Secondly and more likely, possibly part of the reason for the burning was that this was the place that clay was fired. Once a pot was broken they could have been smashed over time or used as 'heat beads' in the next firing. The refined pottery we use is fired at incredible temperatures, this may not have been known to these people and their climate was not condusive to sun drying [which can take months].

Just idle speculation I doubt the ancients would have deliberately tried build soils but they may have been building pots and stumbled across a symbiosis in their process which lead to the terra preta.

I would love more speculation or clarification if anyone has tracked down why the clay shards appear through this mix. The show I saw on terra preta didnt mention them, only found it in further reading.

Cheers

Floot
_________________

Post to permaculture from Michaelangelica

The question, Why clay? is a fascinating one that I don't think has been answered.
It is only associated with terra preta soils and no where else.
I haven't read the book yet so don't know if the clay was porous like terracotta or hard 'stoneware'. I am guessing terracotta.

I guess (hypothesise) two reasons:
1. The clay somehow acts as a catalyst for the whole microbiological thing.
and/or
2. It allows bacteria in the soil to breathe. You can still buy in some places terracotta balls to plant orchids in. I note some American Orchid mixes use charcoal and clay
Would you mind if I posted this and your question on Hypography?
This thread is located at:
http://hypography.com/forums/earth-s...-new-post.html

From floot to michaelangelica

Michaelangelica, feel free to cross post to another forum. Just ask that you post the thread link too and invite some of your posters over here.

I speculated as to how the clay got there. You have speculated as to what it does. I have a BD article saved that I found some years ago which may give further insight into what clay does. BD folk believe that clay acts as a conduit from the depths to the plants.

Welcome over here, I did follow the links to your forum and found it very interesting.

Ok, the original article which I saved is still available on the net and is too big to post here. I am not a BD'er but as a kid I saw an ABC doco on Alex Podolinksy which to my 9yo mind was as amazing as the moon landing. Add to this the discovery of Walter Rodale's Organic Gardening and it has formed a lifelong interest.

http://lists.ifas.ufl.edu/cgi-bin/wa...anet-mg&P=6549

Cheers

floot
_________________
I have never understood Bio-dynamics. It always seemed quasi-religious-gardening but "Stranger things. . . "as the bard says. . .
The above web site is facinating -this is a quote from it-
"Steiner touched on the importance of clay as a mediator between the lime and silica poles of nature. He emphasized clay's primary role in conducting the silica forces, which develop deep within the earth, upward for plant development towards fruit and seed.
He said in lecture two that later he would give recommendations for treating clay to better conduct the growth forces welling out of the earth. However, later he failed to do so.

"Let me remark here that if we are dealing with a soil that does not carry these influences upward during the winter as it should, it is good to furnish that soil with some clay, the dosage of which I will indicate later."
--Rudolf Steiner"

05-05-2006	#57 (permalink)
Michaelangelica Creating 6,099 posts	Re: Terra Preta What is the fuction of the clay pottery shards? I was wandering arround the Permaculture forums and came accross this post which is interesting. You should vist the site if you are into useful plants and gardening. It's great SEE: http://forums.permaculture.org.au/vi...?p=18201#18201 Re: Terra Preta What is the fuction of the clay pottery shards? "PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2006 11:26 pm On reading about the actual terra preta mix and process there are a lot of questions about the presence of clay shards. I havent even read any speculation as to why they are there. Two, things spring to mind. Firstly, the ancients may have been carting this soil to other areas or water to that site but woven baskets would have been more feasible for the soil. Secondly and more likely, possibly part of the reason for the burning was that this was the place that clay was fired. Once a pot was broken they could have been smashed over time or used as 'heat beads' in the next firing. The refined pottery we use is fired at incredible temperatures, this may not have been known to these people and their climate was not condusive to sun drying [which can take months]. Just idle speculation I doubt the ancients would have deliberately tried build soils but they may have been building pots and stumbled across a symbiosis in their process which lead to the terra preta. I would love more speculation or clarification if anyone has tracked down why the clay shards appear through this mix. The show I saw on terra preta didnt mention them, only found it in further reading. Cheers Floot _________________ Post to permaculture from Michaelangelica The question, Why clay? is a fascinating one that I don't think has been answered. It is only associated with terra preta soils and no where else. I haven't read the book yet so don't know if the clay was porous like terracotta or hard 'stoneware'. I am guessing terracotta. I guess (hypothesise) two reasons: 1. The clay somehow acts as a catalyst for the whole microbiological thing. and/or 2. It allows bacteria in the soil to breathe. You can still buy in some places terracotta balls to plant orchids in. I note some American Orchid mixes use charcoal and clay Would you mind if I posted this and your question on Hypography? This thread is located at: http://hypography.com/forums/earth-s...-new-post.html From floot to michaelangelica Michaelangelica, feel free to cross post to another forum. Just ask that you post the thread link too and invite some of your posters over here. I speculated as to how the clay got there. You have speculated as to what it does. I have a BD article saved that I found some years ago which may give further insight into what clay does. BD folk believe that clay acts as a conduit from the depths to the plants. Welcome over here, I did follow the links to your forum and found it very interesting. Ok, the original article which I saved is still available on the net and is too big to post here. I am not a BD'er but as a kid I saw an ABC doco on Alex Podolinksy which to my 9yo mind was as amazing as the moon landing. Add to this the discovery of Walter Rodale's Organic Gardening and it has formed a lifelong interest. http://lists.ifas.ufl.edu/cgi-bin/wa...anet-mg&P=6549 Cheers floot _________________ I have never understood Bio-dynamics. It always seemed quasi-religious-gardening but "Stranger things. . . "as the bard says. . . The above web site is facinating -this is a quote from it- "Steiner touched on the importance of clay as a mediator between the lime and silica poles of nature. He emphasized clay's primary role in conducting the silica forces, which develop deep within the earth, upward for plant development towards fruit and seed. He said in lecture two that later he would give recommendations for treating clay to better conduct the growth forces welling out of the earth. However, later he failed to do so. "Let me remark here that if we are dealing with a soil that does not carry these influences upward during the winter as it should, it is good to furnish that soil with some clay, the dosage of which I will indicate later." --Rudolf Steiner"