Evolution is Fact

Pyrotex · 05-22-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by HydrogenBond

...If you ever tried bush whacking sometimes one may have to back track to get around some obstacles. In terms of a final goal, this could mean the need to de-evolve before continuing to evolve. But without a goal in mind it may look like forward progress. There is a difference in philosophy....

This PRECISELY what does NOT happen with evolution.

Please read, "Climbing Mount Improbable" by Richard Dawkins. It's an easy read--actually fun to read.

Evolution NEVER devolves. The only changes that evolution affects are changes driven by the environment (natural selection). Natural selection will only and CAN ONLY cull out those who are (ever-so slightly) less fit or adaptable to the environment. Evolution is blind.

You may want to read, "The Blind Watchmaker" by R.D. as well.

For evolution to have a "goal" you MUST state where this goal is stored and how the goal was derived. Evolution has no "mind". It has no central repository of knowledge and goal-seeking. It has no "senses" to "see" if it is approaching its goals. It has no "sensory system" to act as a central decision-making process.

The idea of evolution having goals is fairy-tale stuff. It's unsupportable.

OH!!! Warning!!! If you're a true-blue believer in Jehovah and the Holy Book, then reading Richard Dawkins will send you straight to hell for all eternity.

Moontanman · 05-22-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by goku

that is not the only way, but i'll let you think about it
cuz i think you know

Planets spin because the edge of their accretion disk had two different torques affecting it. The vast majority of the mass in the Sun's accretion disk rotated the same way as the star.

As small lumps of rock began to coalesce from the disk they were affected in two ways. The inner edge of their own accretion disk was dragged by the friction of the plane of material rotating around the star, the outer edge was torqued in the opposite direction by the friction of the outer edge. This is not only what imparted rotation to the planets it is also what caused the planets to all rotate in the same direction as the rotation of the sun.

This effect was greater for the gas giants since they became much bigger than the inner rocky worlds by accretion of ices as well as metals and eventually gas.

Later on collisions between large planetoids in the inner solar system either slowed down or speed up the emerging planets and in the case of Venus started the planet slowly rotating in the opposite direction.

This type of collision is what formed the Earth moon system and probably speed up the earth and it may even have formed a large moon in orbit around Venus but orbiting in the wrong direction.

This moon would have quickly spiraled down into Venus due to gravitational drag and contributed to it's odd rotation. On the Earth the collision did the opposite and the moon is today spiraling out from the earth, ever slower, and as it does it slows down the spin of the earth.

These things can be mathematically shown to be the most probable way this happened. The spiraling down of the Earths spin and the slowly retreating moon can be shown to be true by actual measurements. Very nearly all of the states of the planets in our solar system can be explained in this way.

Creation doesn't explain anything it just makes claims that have no data or math to back them up and no correlation with each other to show any connection with each other.

InfiniteNow · 05-22-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pyrotex

This PRECISELY what does NOT happen with evolution.

Please read, "Climbing Mount Impossible" by Richard Dawkins. It's an easy read--actually fun to read.

Did you mean "Climbing Mount Improbable?"

Many of those same concepts were covered in this video which I also shared in post #34 for those who are interested.

'Growing Up in the Universe' Ep 3: Climbing Mount...

Pyrotex · 05-23-2008

Great video, iNow! The devil's chaplain is one of my heroes!

While I am at it... There are TWO "evolutions". One is a FACT. The other is a THEORY.

The FACT of evolution is that animals and plants change over time. The life of 10 million years ago was significantly different than the life we see around us. The life of 100 million years ago was profoundly different. We KNOW this from the fossil record. Fossils are not theories--they are facts. We do not have to jump through hoops to interpret them. They are facts in stone. They are what they are, the remains of animals and plants that lived long, long ago. This cannot be disputed.

The THEORY of evolution is the explanation of HOW plants and animals could change so radically over geologic stretches of time. Not a "guess", but a rational explanation that fits the vast preponderance of the data, based upon a demonstratable MECHANISM of directed change. That mechanism is Natural Selection.

The MECHANISM of Natural Selection, itself depends upon two things: a mechanism of HEREDITY that ensures that each generation of plant and animal will be slightly different (if only statistically) than their parents; and an environment that changes over time. The environment consists of ecosystems (such as food sources, predators, competitors, parasites, etc.) and physical entities (such as mountains, rivers, climate, mineral outcroppings, the tides, chemical makeup of the oceans, etc.).

The mechanism of HEREDITY is crucial to the explanation (theory) of evolution. It has to pass qualities down not just to the next generation, but to thousands of generations in a fashion that allows the storage of biological solutions and functions that can be selected from -- where the history of the creature's heredity is stored in a way so it is still accessible to some extent in the current generation. Darwin was clear that heredity had to work within a very narrow outline or his theory would not work. A century later, we discover DNA and the science of genetics, and realize that the mechanism of heredity common to all life on Earth is EXACTLY what is needed to support the theory of evolution.

The THEORY of evolution is not merely an explanation, but an incredibly successful explanation, tieing together the facts in the stones with the facts in the DNA as no other explanation has even come close to doing.

Moontanman · 05-23-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pyrotex

Great video, iNow! The devil's chaplain is one of my heroes!

While I am at it... There are TWO "evolutions". One is a FACT. The other is a THEORY.

The FACT of evolution is that animals and plants change over time. The life of 10 million years ago was significantly different than the life we see around us. The life of 100 million years ago was profoundly different. We KNOW this from the fossil record. Fossils are not theories--they are facts. We do not have to jump through hoops to interpret them. They are facts in stone. They are what they are, the remains of animals and plants that lived long, long ago. This cannot be disputed.

The THEORY of evolution is the explanation of HOW plants and animals could change so radically over geologic stretches of time. Not a "guess", but a rational explanation that fits the vast preponderance of the data, based upon a demonstratable MECHANISM of directed change. That mechanism is Natural Selection.

The MECHANISM of evolution, itself depends upon two things: a mechanism of HEREDITY that ensures that each generation of plant and animal will be slightly different (if only statistically) than their parents; and an environment that changes over time. The environment consists of ecosystems (such as food sources, predators, competitors, parasites, etc.) and physical entities (such as mountains, rivers, climate, mineral outcroppings, the tides, chemical makeup of the oceans, etc.).

The mechanism of HEREDITY is crucial to the explanation (theory) of evolution. It has to pass qualities down not just to the next generation, but to thousands of generations in a fashion that allows the storage of biological solutions and functions that can be selected from -- in a fashion where the history of the creature's heredity is stored or frozen in a way where it is still accessible to some extent in the current generation. Darwin was clear that heredity had to work within very narrow outline or his theory would not work. A century later, we discover DNA and the science of genetics, and realize that the mechanism of heredity common to all life on Earth is EXACTLY what is needed to support the theory of evolution.

The THEORY of evolution is not merely an explanation, but an incredibly successful explanation, tieing together the facts in the stones with the facts in the DNA as no other explanation has even come close to doing.

Great explanation Pyro, I wish everyone could see the beauty of the truth in these statements.

REASON · 05-23-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by Moontanman

Great explanation Pyro, I wish everyone could see the beauty of the truth in these statements.

Seconded!

goku · 05-23-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by InfiniteNow

I just sense that you are repeating the misguided ignorant comments of others, as opposed to speaking sincerely with your own voice.

from who? i git all my information from here.

goku · 05-23-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by REASON

What is 182,251 x 5. And I Can prove it.

is it the right answer? so many answers would work.
scientists have great imaginations, but their's is no greater than yours.

when you believe them you give them power, power to control you.
because of so called global warming, they will control what light bulbs you can buy, and they brain washed you into thinking that you are helping yourself by taking their light bulb.

i don't know if that came out right, sometimes it's hard for me to put into words the thoughts in my head, even worse with a key board

REASON · 05-23-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by goku

Science wasn't invented

Science most certainly was invented, just as every other tool developed and used throughout the history of humankind.

In fact, science has evolved as well.