What constitutes a species?

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 07-03-2008
Questioning

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: South Africa
Posts: 192
mynah is a splendid one to beholdmynah is a splendid one to beholdmynah is a splendid one to beholdmynah is a splendid one to beholdmynah is a splendid one to beholdmynah is a splendid one to beholdmynah is a splendid one to beholdmynah is a splendid one to behold
Re: What constitutes a species?

I'm not sure if this was the exact site where I saw it, but it certainly was the same context. To be honest, I've never been a fan of SJG...

Replaying Gould
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 07-03-2008
Pyrotex's Avatar
Slaying Bad Memes
Latest blog: I need a Vacation
Hypography Staff Member
Moderator
Editor
13 Days in Hell Champion!
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 3,875
Blog Entries: 8
Pyrotex has a reputation beyond reputePyrotex has a reputation beyond reputePyrotex has a reputation beyond reputePyrotex has a reputation beyond reputePyrotex has a reputation beyond reputePyrotex has a reputation beyond reputePyrotex has a reputation beyond reputePyrotex has a reputation beyond reputePyrotex has a reputation beyond reputePyrotex has a reputation beyond reputePyrotex has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via MSN to Pyrotex
Re: What constitutes a species?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mynah View Post
Interesting question, but a quote I read comes to mind: Man classifies, nature does not.
Excellent and pithy.
Many folks find this a very difficult concept to get their minds around.
Nature does not recognize "species". There are no hard and fast boundaries separating one species from another. Our human-defined definitions are heuristics, or rules-of-thumb.
That two similar but distinct species should not be cross-fertile (and produce fertile progeny) works pretty well most of the time. There are many exceptions.
There are even "ring-species" mentioned in an earlier post that show that even though Animal Group A may be able to cross-breed with Animal Group B, and B may be able to cross-breed with C, it is entirely possible that Animal Groups A and C are infertile with each other.

Therefore A and C are of different species. Yet A is the same species as B is the same species as C.
__________________
Hypography Forums Moderator
-- - - - - -
What concerns me is not the way things are, but rather the way people think things are.
Epictetus, Greek Philosopher
The map is NOT the territory.
Korzybski, Polish-American Philosopher
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 07-03-2008
freeztar's Avatar
Wedding Planner
Latest blog: Things to bring
Hypography Staff Member
Moderator
Editor
Silver Subscription
Sponsor
Re: What constitutes a species?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mynah View Post
I'm not sure if this was the exact site where I saw it, but it certainly was the same context. To be honest, I've never been a fan of SJG...

Replaying Gould
I've never read any Gould myself, but I remember about a year or so ago, someone here at Hypo stated that Gould did not give credence to homoplasy. I've been quite suspect of his ideas since then. The article you linked to pushes me further away from his ideas.

Quote:
Originally Posted by from your link
But, here, Gould (also Mayr 2001, see p. 209) has forgotten a principle which is so fundamental it has become hackneyed: man classifies; nature does not.
So it seems that it wasn't Gould that made the remark as in this case it is being used against his ideas. Looking up the phrase in google returns only three links and it is unclear from any of them where this phrase came from.
__________________
Hypography Science Forums Moderator
---
"There are no passengers on Spaceship Earth. We are all crew." - Marshall McLuhan

"We must not forget that when radium was discovered no one knew that it would prove useful in hospitals. The work was one of pure science. And this is a proof that scientific work must not be considered from the point of view of the direct usefulness of it." - Marie Curie
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old 07-04-2008
Questioning

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: South Africa
Posts: 192
mynah is a splendid one to beholdmynah is a splendid one to beholdmynah is a splendid one to beholdmynah is a splendid one to beholdmynah is a splendid one to beholdmynah is a splendid one to beholdmynah is a splendid one to beholdmynah is a splendid one to behold
Re: What constitutes a species?

I found this website quite interesting after reading Wonderful life by Gould. Personally I found Gould's "heroes and villains" approach intensely irritating. Evidently the hero of his book was not too charmed, either...

Gould vs Conway-Morris
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old 07-04-2008
coldcreation's Avatar
Resident Bright
Asteroids Champion!
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Barcelona and CT
Posts: 1,067
coldcreation is a name known to allcoldcreation is a name known to allcoldcreation is a name known to allcoldcreation is a name known to allcoldcreation is a name known to allcoldcreation is a name known to allcoldcreation is a name known to allcoldcreation is a name known to all
Send a message via AIM to coldcreation Send a message via Skype™ to coldcreation
Re: What constitutes a species?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mynah View Post
I found this website quite interesting after reading Wonderful life by Gould. Personally I found Gould's "heroes and villains" approach intensely irritating. Evidently the hero of his book was not too charmed, either...

Gould vs Conway-Morris

Creationist critics often charge that evolution cannot be tested, and therefore cannot be viewed as a properly scientific subject at all. This claim is rhetorical nonsense.
(Stephen Jay Gould)



.
__________________
Coldcreation
Reply With Quote
  #16 (permalink)  
Old 07-04-2008
coldcreation's Avatar
Resident Bright
Asteroids Champion!
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Barcelona and CT
Posts: 1,067
coldcreation is a name known to allcoldcreation is a name known to allcoldcreation is a name known to allcoldcreation is a name known to allcoldcreation is a name known to allcoldcreation is a name known to allcoldcreation is a name known to allcoldcreation is a name known to all
Send a message via AIM to coldcreation Send a message via Skype™ to coldcreation
Re: What constitutes a species?

This is my favorite:


While the rest of the species is descended from apes, redheads are descended from cats.
(Mark Twain)




CC
__________________
Coldcreation
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
One Species' Genome Discovered Inside Another Species' Genome C1ay General Science News 1 09-04-2007
One species, many genomes C1ay General Science News 0 07-25-2007
What exactly constitutes life? someguy Biology 60 04-29-2007
What constitutes Life? hallenrm Articles 4 08-15-2006
Future of our Species? skuzie Philosophy and Humanities 40 05-29-2006

» Current Poll
Favorite James Bond?
Sean Connery - 66.67%
6 Votes
George Lazenby - 0%
0 Votes
David Niven - 11.11%
1 Vote
Roger Moore - 11.11%
1 Vote
Timothy Dalton - 0%
0 Votes
Pierce Brosnan - 0%
0 Votes
Daniel Craig - 11.11%
1 Vote
Hate 'em all - 0%
0 Votes
Who's James Bond? - 0%
0 Votes
Total Votes: 9
You may not vote on this poll.

All times are GMT -8. The time now is 08:47 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
SEO by vBSEO 3.2.0 ©2008, Crawlability, Inc.
Copyright © 2000-2008 Hypography
Part of the Hypography - Science for Everyone Network