Evolution Pros and Cons

[Pyrotex]

Originally Posted by questor

This thread shows that none of us are experts on this subject. I do not think the evidence of evolution is overwhelming as yet.When it is, there will be no questions from me. ...None of the biochemical molecules have a brain, so what causes their activity?

Wrong again, Darth Questor.
There are several of us here who are experts, to the extent that we are more knowledgeable about evolution, biochemistry and genetics than 99% of the general population. You are not numbered in that select few.

The fact that you don't find the evidence overwhelming is not only irrelevant---it is meaningless. You are a super-troll; you are not driven by or even influenced by "evidence". You have your dogmatic devotion to your dogmatic point-of-view, and nothing will change that. We have your past behavior here at Hypography as sufficient evidence to convince us of this: "...and ye shall know them by their fruits."

It follows, therefore, that your promise that "there will be no questions from me" is equally vacuous. You will NEVER relent to "evidence"---you will only mock it.

Your final question concerning the "brain" behind chemical reactions is your most prominent "fruit" here. If you had ANY idea how much it reveals about your stiff-necked ignorance and your arrogant lack of integrity, you would not have said it. But of course, you did say it, and it reveals your hand to one and all.

Pyrotex
Slayer of Bad Memes,
And the "Sith Lords" who spread them

[questor]

Pyro, your attacks are becoming more vicious and against the supposed aims and rules of the forum. If you are the expert you claim to be, why not explain the points I have raised instead of demeaning me for raising them? I can't see where your comments do anything to further the knowledge of anyone, they coarsen the discourse. You seem to think I am the only person around that has questions about
the explanations about evolution.
If you want to have disagreements with me personally, be man enough to do it on private mail.

[Moontanman]

Originally Posted by questor

You seem to think I am the only person around that has questions about
the explanations about evolution.
.

Questor, the number of people with questions doesn't make the information questionable. So far you are the one making strange claims about intelligent casual factors. I would like to see some evidence for such a causal factor that isn't just disbelief that anything can occur with out it.

[questor]

Moon, from now on when you attribute a statement to me, please furnish the quote in context so I can determine what you are getting at.
''So far you are the one making strange claims about intelligent casual factors.''

[Galapagos]

Questor, the fact that you can't come up with a better explanation for mundane physical and chemical interactions than supernatural agency is silly. It is also no more of an objection to evolution than it is to me mixing my coffee in the morning.
This thread has turned into theology IMO. If you have any valid objections to evolution specifically, feel free to post them here.
If you want to continue discussing your own god of the gaps theology, perhaps now is the time to take it to the theology forum.

Here is a good read about evolution, agency detection, and religion for those interested:
Gene Expression: The gods of the cognitive scientists

[Moontanman]

from Questor, Now, you answer this question. Comparing life to an orchestra, with the instruments being the genes and the players being the biochemical enzymes and the music being the product; who is the conductor, and who wrote the music?

from questor, Every link you have posted gives reactions which must have some causal factor. Do you know what that factor is?
None of the biochemical molecules have a brain, so what causes their activity?

from Questor, I do believe that the answers to life, evolution, thought and reason lie somewhere below the molecular level and can be explained by understanding the force or impetus that causes carbon compounds to act as they do.

from Questor, I am not religious, but I do think the universe has intelligent design. If not, how could there be order, orbiting, gravity, physical forces, evolution, and the universe itself? There should have been chaos if there was a big bang and we would not exist. This indicates to me that some type of planning has occurred. I do not know how to explain it.

from Questor, I believe in cause and effect. everything has a cause. Once you determine the cause, you may be able to create the effect.

from Questor, Every link you have posted gives reactions which must have some causal factor. Do you know what that factor is?
None of the biochemical molecules have a brain, so what causes their activity?

from Questor, In organic compounds, the reaction may need a catalyst and/or heat. In living tissue the reactions for genetic replication are timed and seem planned. This is why they say genes contain information. They may occur at a certain time(baldness, puberty, genetic diseases), and under certain conditions. They are not spontaneous and occur with reason. Genetic activity is directed and time sensitive as if someone is controlling the process. It is not random or chaotic.

I think your next step is to say, Michael, I am sorry i made such a disingenuous allegation toward you, I have several times alluded to a intelligent design, a causal factor and stated many times that these chemical reactions need a reason or guiding intelligence.

[Thunderbird]

Originally Posted by questor

Pyro, your attacks are becoming more vicious and against the supposed aims and rules of the forum. If you are the expert you claim to be, why not explain the points I have raised instead of demeaning me for raising them? I can't see where your comments do anything to further the knowledge of anyone, they coarsen the discourse. You seem to think I am the only person around that has questions about
the explanations about evolution.
If you want to have disagreements with me personally, be man enough to do it on private mail.

Pyro’s attacks are aimed at your flawed logic dubious intent and lack of humility in the face of evidence brought into view by sincere people that have for generations worked and studied so we might learn.
A prerequisite to give a fair assessment of evolution requires objective curiosity along with years of reading and rereading this evidence.
We have many members that are here to gain knowledge from those who have shelves stuffed with these dog eared science books. A LITTLE HUMILITY and a lot more home work is your best solution, but as pyro’s has pointed out, that is not you’re real intent here.

[questor]

Michael, I am sorry you have made more of my statements than I said.
''I am not religious, but I do think the universe has intelligent design.''
This statement says I am not religious, but I THINK the universe has intelligent design. This is my opinion, I do not make any claims, I do not talk about religion. I do not say I am certain there is ID or make any claims for it. From my observation of the universe I see evidence of order, not chaos.

''I believe in cause and effect. everything has a cause. Once you determine the cause, you may be able to create the effect.''
This statement says everything(effect) has a cause. This has nothing to do with God or religion, it has to do with the concept of cause and effect. If you know some effects that have no cause please say whay they are. You may want to google it. If you know the cause of the biochemical basis of life, tell me the reactions and how they are carried out. As a matter of fact, why don't you explain life itself to me ,since that is what we are talking abou?.
Why do you continue to talk about this issue when I have made myself perfectly clear? We have already covered these arguments before.

[questor]

Galapagos, I thought you were having trouble reading my posts, now I am sure of it. Please give the quotes where I have referred to religion or God. Instead of discussing the biochemical basis of evolution, you bring up the strawman of religion. No one is talking about religion but you and Moon. If these biochemical reactions are mundane, why don't you discuss how the genetic code is passed on and explain why the researchers can't do it?

[questor]

T-bird, there have been discussions on this site arguing opposing views about SR, the Big Bang, politics and many other issues. I do not hold myself out as an expert, but I do have a right to my opinion. I do not insult people or belittle them, and I should receive the same treatment. Pyro has attacked me verbally on three occasions and I have not retaliated. How humble should I be? I don't know all the answers and I respect the knowledge and talent of many of the members here. I came here to learn and not be insulted for my views. When I learn the truth I readily accept it.Do you think there is something wrong with my questions or are my questions already in the realm of knowledge? Have you read this thread?