[LiquidAlchemist]

I just saw this movie a few days ago and thought it was excellent. I thought the movie really put the spotlight on how the Oil Companies of the World have had such a strong influence on America and how much of a strong hold they have on us and even our Government.
Anyway, I'm just curious to know what your opoions are on the movie? Do you agree on who is Guilty and who is not Gulty on killing what could have been the wave of the future for transportation?
I strongly agree with how much opposition they show toward oil companies in this movie. The fact that these people make 55,000+ every minute from shooting this stuff from the ground is really sickening (plus the fact that they do what it takes to denounce the existence of Global Warming is worse.)

[TheBigDog]

The electric car is dead because they suck when compared to a regular car. If they were practical they would be around. They are not practical, so they are not around.

Question for you...

Where does the electricity come from that charges an electric car?

Bill

[infamous]

Excellent point BigDog, and BTW; Electricity looses much of it's energy just in the transmission of it from the power station to your home. I vote for bio-diesel or maybe the hydrogen fuel cell. Either method is better than pluging your car into a houshold outlet,.........IMHO..............Infy

[CraigD]

Originally Posted by LiquidAlchemist

I just saw this movie a few days ago and thought it was excellent. I thought the movie really put the spotlight on how the Oil Companies of the World have had such a strong influence on America and how much of a strong hold they have on us and even our Government.
Anyway, I'm just curious to know what your opoions are on the movie? Do you agree on who is Guilty and who is not Gulty on killing what could have been the wave of the future for transportation?

I’ve been meaning to see this movie since I noticed it in a nearby theatre – it’s well reviewed, and said to present a good summary of the “rise and fall” of zero-emission vehicles in the 1990s, especially with regards to California’s “2% by the year 1998” initiative. I haven’t yet, so can’t give a first-hand opinion.

I strongly agree with how much opposition they show toward oil companies in this movie. The fact that these people make 55,000+ every minute from shooting this stuff from the ground is really sickening (plus the fact that they do what it takes to denounce the existence of Global Warming is worse.)

Unfortunately, the manipulation of science to promote commercial ventures is not confined to energy companies – nearly every industry, from fast food to pharmacology, appears to tend toward the ethic of “it’s only unethical if you get caught”. This likely illustrates an ingrained property of human nature, thought that’s a topic for another thread.

Originally Posted by TheBigDog

The electric car is dead because they suck when compared to a regular car. If they were practical they would be around. They are not practical, so they are not around.

That’s certainly one of the main explanations given, but fails to explain some objective data, such as the refusal of GM to allow the purchase of leased EV1s when the program was halted in 2003.

Where does the electricity come from that charges an electric car?

For a small introduction, the electricity comes from existing household electric utilities – these cars are just plugged into a 110 or 220 V outlet. In the case of an EV1, via a bulky “stay at home” unit that allowed the car to be charged using an inductive “paddle” rather than a conventional plug.

One should note that much of the popular and political enthusiasm for electric cars has to do with their potential to improve urban air quality, rather than their ability to be charged by electricity from a flexible variety of generation sources.

I’m skeptical of conspiracy theories. It appears that, most of the time, business decisions are driven by the desire of company leaders to maximize profits (although these decisions are sometimes spectacularly wrong). However, the failure of ZEVs to gain even a modest market foothold in the US, despite government support and popular interest, deserves serious public discussion and analysis. If “Who Killed the Electric Car” can promote this, it’s done a public service, and should not be dismissed as a “crank documentary”.

[pgrmdave]

Would an electric car really save energy? Would it really save fossil fuels from being burned? Or is the fuel cost of producing the electricity for the car greater than the fuel cost of running a gas powered car? It seems to me that you aren't actually saving any energy, but I don't have any hard numbers.

[Zythryn]

Originally Posted by pgrmdave

Would an electric car really save energy?

As for after it has been built, yes. At least in the case of the Tesla model coming out next year. For some hard numbers see http://www.teslamotors.com/learn_mor...efficiency.php or for another explaination see http://www.teslamotors.com/blog1/?p=8#more-8

The batteries are recyclable and last for 100,000 miles.

No motor oil or other fluids are consumed. The electricity, in my case, will come from solar cells and the standard electric grid.

Aside from the enviornment, my primary interest in this company is getting off of the oil addiction. I figure if this tech becomes common we can eliminate mideast oil which would be a major plus to our economy IMHO.

edit-I don't know if the construction of the vehicle costs more energy than constructing other vehicles, good question though.

[TheFaithfulStone]

Originally Posted by Zythryn

I figure if this tech becomes common we can eliminate mideast oil which would be a major plus to our economy IMHO.

Not to mention our foreign policy.

Oil? Pshaw!

TFS

[Erasmus00]

Originally Posted by TheBigDog

The electric car is dead because they suck when compared to a regular car. If they were practical they would be around. They are not practical, so they are not around.

Question for you...

Where does the electricity come from that charges an electric car?

Keep in mind that people that leased prototype EV1s from GM were not allowed to purchase them when they ended the program in 2003. Many people did in fact want to purchase the cars. What specifically do you mean when you claim they sucked? Do you have numbers for the cars range, or max acceleration?

Also, keep in mind the advantage to the electric car isn't necessarily reducing oil consumption but cleaning up the air quality in cities.
-Will

[Zythryn]

Originally Posted by Erasmus00

Keep in mind that people that leased prototype EV1s from GM were not allowed to purchase them when they ended the program in 2003. Many people did in fact want to purchase the cars. What specifically do you mean when you claim they sucked? Do you have numbers for the cars range, or max acceleration?

Also, keep in mind the advantage to the electric car isn't necessarily reducing oil consumption but cleaning up the air quality in cities.
-Will

Not to speak for BD, however the range as I recall was 80-100 miles?
I was never aware that the EV1 existed until this movie. If it were offered now with those stats, I would buy one in a second. However, since I am married my wife would keep a longer range vehicle so we could use the EV1 for around town and the other car for longer trips.

I am not sure about the top speed and acceleration of the EV1?

Luckily, battery tech has improved and I expect will continue to improve. The Tesla has a range of 250 between charges which is much closer to the range of gas filled vehicles. Still couldn't take it across country, but good enough (I think/hope) to catch on.

And, since the Tesla can beat a porsche in a 0-60 contest it seems performance is no longer an issue

[CraigD]

Originally Posted by Zythryn

Not to speak for BD, however the range as I recall was 80-100 miles?
…
I am not sure about the top speed and acceleration of the EV1?

The wikipedia article “EV1” has a pretty good summary of the performance and history of the EV1.

Basically, it was limited by it’s single speed transmission to a top speed of about 80 MPH. It’s 0-60 time was about 8 sec.

Changing the fixed gear ratio allowed a modified EV1 prototype to set a land speed record for production electric vehicles of 183 MPH, using the same engine, battery, body and other parts as a regular production EV1.

Their range was limited – from 50-75 Miles with the first generation lead-acid batteries, to 75-150 with the last-generation NiMHs.