Go Back   Science Forums > Physical Sciences Forums > Environmental Studies
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 08-07-2008   #101 (permalink)
freeztar's Avatar
M.C. Grillmeister

Moderator
Editor
Basic Subscription
Sponsor

Location:
ATL, GA, USA
Latest blog entry:
 
freeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond repute
 



Not Ranked  0 score     
Re: Bugs and Butterflies

Interesting. The blue variety (like the pic at wiki) would match nicely with the lupine flowers they are said to love. I wonder if the white variety has the same affinity.


----------------
Hypography Science Forums Moderator
---
"There are no passengers on Spaceship Earth. We are all crew." - Marshall McLuhan

"We must not forget that when radium was discovered no one knew that it would prove useful in hospitals. The work was one of pure science. And this is a proof that scientific work must not be considered from the point of view of the direct usefulness of it." - Marie Curie
Reply With Quote
Old 08-07-2008   #102 (permalink)
Cedars's Avatar
Creating

Silver Subscription
Sponsor

Location:
Minnesota
 
Cedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond repute
 



Not Ranked  0 score     
Re: Bugs and Butterflies

Quote:
Originally Posted by freeztar View Post
Interesting. The blue variety (like the pic at wiki) would match nicely with the lupine flowers they are said to love. I wonder if the white variety has the same affinity.
You mean white Lupine?

BTW, I discovered there is a very similar species, the Northern Blue (Lycaeides idas) that could be confused with the Karner and has the orange going up the outside of both wings. But the Northern Blue and Karner habitats are not known to overlap in Wisconsin, and there are no known Northern Blues in any of the counties surrounding Crex Meadows. Northern Blues and Karners have very different caterpillar host plants also.
Reply With Quote
Old 08-07-2008   #103 (permalink)
freeztar's Avatar
M.C. Grillmeister

Moderator
Editor
Basic Subscription
Sponsor

Location:
ATL, GA, USA
Latest blog entry:
 
freeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond repute
 



Not Ranked  0 score     
Re: Bugs and Butterflies

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cedars View Post
You mean white Lupine?
I'm not sure really because I've never been there, but my understanding is that the only lupine that grows (wild) in the Great Lakes region is this one:
PLANTS Profile for Lupinus polyphyllus (bigleaf lupine) | USDA PLANTS

White lupine seems to be a genetic variation of L. Angustifolia from what I can tell with a few searches. Overall it seems that blue is the dominant color for Lupinus.
Quote:
BTW, I discovered there is a very similar species, the Northern Blue (Lycaeides idas) that could be confused with the Karner and has the orange going up the outside of both wings. But the Northern Blue and Karner habitats are not known to overlap in Wisconsin, and there are no known Northern Blues in any of the counties surrounding Crex Meadows. Northern Blues and Karners have very different caterpillar host plants also.
That begs the question....
What caterpillar host plant does the Northern Blue require?


----------------
Hypography Science Forums Moderator
---
"There are no passengers on Spaceship Earth. We are all crew." - Marshall McLuhan

"We must not forget that when radium was discovered no one knew that it would prove useful in hospitals. The work was one of pure science. And this is a proof that scientific work must not be considered from the point of view of the direct usefulness of it." - Marie Curie
Reply With Quote
Old 08-08-2008   #104 (permalink)
Cedars's Avatar
Creating

Silver Subscription
Sponsor

Location:
Minnesota
 
Cedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond repute
 



Not Ranked  0 score     
Re: Bugs and Butterflies

Quote:
Originally Posted by freeztar View Post
I'm not sure really because I've never been there, but my understanding is that the only lupine that grows (wild) in the Great Lakes region is this one:
PLANTS Profile for Lupinus polyphyllus (bigleaf lupine) | USDA PLANTS

White lupine seems to be a genetic variation of L. Angustifolia from what I can tell with a few searches. Overall it seems that blue is the dominant color for Lupinus.
Yes, thats the lupine, white or blue, but what did you mean by..

"I wonder if the white variety has the same affinity."

Quote:
Originally Posted by freeztar View Post
That begs the question....
What caterpillar host plant does the Northern Blue require?
Habitat: Open pine forests where its host plant Dwarf Bilberry (Vaccinium caespitosum) occurs. The host plant is also a Wisconsin endangered species.

wisconsinbutterflies.org | Northern Blue

Seems the Northern Blue has a critically endangered status also:

Species Detail | Butterflies and Moths of North America
Reply With Quote
Old 08-08-2008   #105 (permalink)
freeztar's Avatar
M.C. Grillmeister

Moderator
Editor
Basic Subscription
Sponsor

Location:
ATL, GA, USA
Latest blog entry:
 
freeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond repute
 



Not Ranked  0 score     
Re: Bugs and Butterflies

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cedars View Post
Yes, thats the lupine, white or blue, but what did you mean by..

"I wonder if the white variety has the same affinity."
The pic you posted shows a white butterfly. The pic at wiki shows a blue butterfly. I'm curious if this genetic variation is random (like albino) or if it is selected for based on the host plants that the two varieties might use. It seems that from what you are saying, there is no selective advantage in the colors.

In other words, it seems that the blue color of the butterfly would blend well with the blue lupine flowers, keeping it hidden from predators. The white variety would not share this camoflouge and might be presumed to prefer white flower plants instead.

It was just speculation that appears to not hold any weight...


----------------
Hypography Science Forums Moderator
---
"There are no passengers on Spaceship Earth. We are all crew." - Marshall McLuhan

"We must not forget that when radium was discovered no one knew that it would prove useful in hospitals. The work was one of pure science. And this is a proof that scientific work must not be considered from the point of view of the direct usefulness of it." - Marie Curie
Reply With Quote
Old 08-08-2008   #106 (permalink)
Cedars's Avatar
Creating

Silver Subscription
Sponsor

Location:
Minnesota
 
Cedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond repute
 



Not Ranked  0 score     
Re: Bugs and Butterflies

Quote:
Originally Posted by freeztar View Post
The pic you posted shows a white butterfly. The pic at wiki shows a blue butterfly. I'm curious if this genetic variation is random (like albino) or if it is selected for based on the host plants that the two varieties might use. It seems that from what you are saying, there is no selective advantage in the colors.
Ah ha!

The Karner Blue (Melissa Karner blue is another name for the same butterfly) is the white spotted color on the under side. The blue shows on its top side and I only got one semi-decent picture of the open wing (in flight). Females can be almost brown with orange spots on the lower wing. Males are blue on top, with just a white border and black line between the border and the blue.

This page has an interesting photo essay on the karners (link to it on right side):
Nature Conservancy Magazine: Spring 2007 - Rhapsody in Blue - Karner blue butterfly - butterflies
Reply With Quote
Old 08-08-2008   #107 (permalink)
freeztar's Avatar
M.C. Grillmeister

Moderator
Editor
Basic Subscription
Sponsor

Location:
ATL, GA, USA
Latest blog entry:
 
freeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond reputefreeztar has a reputation beyond repute
 



Not Ranked  0 score     
Re: Bugs and Butterflies

Aha...

That was a good link. I love TNC.

I didn't realize they were so small...


----------------
Hypography Science Forums Moderator
---
"There are no passengers on Spaceship Earth. We are all crew." - Marshall McLuhan

"We must not forget that when radium was discovered no one knew that it would prove useful in hospitals. The work was one of pure science. And this is a proof that scientific work must not be considered from the point of view of the direct usefulness of it." - Marie Curie
Reply With Quote
Old 08-21-2008   #108 (permalink)
Cedars's Avatar
Creating

Silver Subscription
Sponsor

Location:
Minnesota
 
Cedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond repute
 



Not Ranked  0 score     
Re: Phantom Crane Fly

Took another trip to crex meadows on the 19th. Butterfly numbers are falling, but once again, the meadows revealed something new or seldom seen. I had seen the phantom crane fly a few times in my life and found my first on the meadows.

The picture quality isnt the best, as the camera had much difficulty spotting this thin critter and kept focusing on the background. I had to manually focus which is a problem area for me.

These guys fly funny. Apparently their wide legs help them glide as their teeny wings beat furiously. When I first saw it, I thought it was a spider moving through the grass.

More info on the phantom crane fly:
eNature: FieldGuides: Species Detail
Attached Thumbnails
Bugs and Butterflies-phcrane1.jpg  
Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2008   #109 (permalink)
Cedars's Avatar
Creating

Silver Subscription
Sponsor

Location:
Minnesota
 
Cedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond reputeCedars has a reputation beyond repute
 



Not Ranked  0 score     
Re: Robber Fly

This family of predators varies in size and color. Some look like bumble bees, some look like long legged flys and some look like these.

The likely specie for this one is the Milbert's Proctacanthus - Proctacanthus milbertii but because I did not get a good shot of its tail, it could also fall under the Proctacanthus brevipennis specie. The wing length is also an identifying factor as is the flight time, but insect data is always improving so the person who ID'd this one would not commit to Milberts without mentioning brevipennis as a potential ID.
Attached Thumbnails
Bugs and Butterflies-rob1.jpg  
Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2008   #110 (permalink)
Monomer's Avatar
Explaining


Location:
Adelaide, South Australia
 
Monomer has much to be proud ofMonomer has much to be proud ofMonomer has much to be proud ofMonomer has much to be proud ofMonomer has much to be proud ofMonomer has much to be proud ofMonomer has much to be proud of
 



Not Ranked  0 score     
Re: Bugs and Butterflies

I found this rather large ant (at least I think it's an ant) in my garden one day. I thought the other ants were kinda large, but this one was a little over an inch long. I was wondering if anyone has seen anything like it before and knows what it is.

Bugs and Butterflies-big-ant-1.jpg Bugs and Butterflies-big-ant-2.jpg
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
bug, butterfly, insect, spiders


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
What Bugs You ??? Racoon Watercooler 63 04-30-2008 06:37 AM
Bugs may have deep-sea ancestors theblackalchemist Science News Elsewhere 0 07-04-2007 04:39 AM
Kamikaze Love Bugs orbsycli Biology 5 05-27-2007 08:23 PM
Bugs Problem stealth Science Projects and Homework 0 10-04-2006 02:43 PM
The butterflies orbsycli Watercooler 5 02-25-2005 01:02 AM

» Advertisement
» Current Poll
Who's the sexiest man alive? Johnny Depp or Robert Pattinson?
Johnny Depp - 30.00%
3 Votes
Robert Pattinson - 0%
0 Votes
Someone else (please specify) - 40.00%
4 Votes
I'm too macho to think a guy is sexy - 30.00%
3 Votes
Total Votes: 10
You may not vote on this poll.


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 06:33 AM.

Hypography?

Hypography [n.]: A combination of "hyperlink" and "bibliography" - ie, a list of links to electronic documents. Comparable to discography and bibliography, but not cartography.

We have been online since May 2000, and aim to be the best place to find and share science-related content of all kinds.

Share the love!

Please add more science to your life. Use our RSS feeds on your blog, your portal, or your favorite feedreader!


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.3
Copyright ©2000 - 2009, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.3.2
Copyright © 2000-2009 Hypography
Part of the Hypography - Science for Everyone Network