My belief in Global Warming is getting shaky

[belovelife]

i think we need to adapt our current teqnologies to survuve and at the same time reduce our impact, although i wish we could hit a communal suck button that stops our impact on global ecology, the likelyness of that is slim to none
china needs to compete in the global market
americans need to drive hummers the the store to pick up groceries, and the navy needs to use sonar to deafen the whales, these are facts, solutions to the given circumstances are neccisary,

[engineerdude]

Originally Posted by Zythryn

So your belief in global warming is dependent upon the cost effectiveness of possible solutions??

*Sigh*

I have detailed at length why I think people have nothing to do with global climate. The above post was an answer to a direct question as to why I think Green technology is not a good idea at this time.

[Michaelangelica]

'Sigh'

people have nothing to do with global climate

I despair of people who say 'not enough research has been done' etc when they refuse to read and review the research that is available under their noses.

• ever heard of CFCs?
• ever read mush about the man made changes in landscapes in the last 10,000 years?.
• ever read about how trees can make rain?
• ever read about desertification?
• ever heard of salinity?
• ever heard of the albedo effect?
• ever looked at how the coral in the worlds oceans is turning to dust?
• read about the 10 major rivers in the world running dry?
• ever heard of "tipping points'?
• ever read the USA defence force plans for future climate change?
• ever read the UK defence force plans for future climate change?

You, of course may be right. But please put your "rightness" in some time frame. Are you going to be right for 10 or 100 years given the trends in environmental degradation and population growth we have now?

PS
Glad your electricity is so 'cheap" Ever wonder why?

PSS
Climate modelling is a very new and imprecise science. Like most modelling
However these articles may give you some food for thought

Our best estimates of climate sensitivity tell us that the warming is very unlikely to be less than 1.5°C, and will most likely fall in the range of 2°C to 4.5°C. For the next 20 years, warming of around 0.2°C per decade is predicted across a wide range of projected economic and political scenarios. Even if greenhouse gas concentrations had been stabilized in 2000, the temperature would continue to increase by 0.1°C per decade. Due to the immense thermal momentum of the ocean, warming and sea level rise would continue for centuries. Even the best-case, lowest-emission scenario suggests an increase of 1.8°C, while the best estimate for the high scenario results in an increase of 4°C or more.

http://www.copenhagenclimatecouncil....te-change.html
and
to be really cynical
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/andrew...n_b_97959.html

[Little Bang]

To those people who don't believe that man has initiated a change in the climate that will wipe out over ninety percent of all life on this planet in the next two hundred years. They confuse the truth with what they want it to be. Their position is the same as playing Russian roulette. To argue with the fact that almost seven billion people burning fossil fuels is not a potential disaster is ludicrous. Personally I think we have already passed the point of no return. The momentum of such a large population is to big for us to be able to stop. The perception that humans should be allowed to have children anytime and in any numbers that they want cannot be changed and that is why I think it to late.

[belovelife]

arn't we only dedicated to a one degree temp change as of today?
i was under the assumtion that a 5 degree temp change would release the methane in the ocean and cause a snowball effect
although that would not happen for i think 50 more years of current carbondioxide realease as today

i don't think we are at the deep end yet
although 50 years is a short amount of time

have you heard of turby

[Little Bang]

The 5 degree change refers to ocean temp and some where in the very near future it will reach that level.

[belovelife]

yes at which point itaccelerates the methane molecule that is currently in a gel like state, o the point of releasing a gas, the amount of this gas added to the atmoshere would hold more of the suns energy in the atmoshere
i think when it gets a 5 degree temp change here in sd where i live we are expecting something like 130f average days
if so, i would ned to fix my air conditioner
(or build an ionic breese the size of several skyscrapers to
co2 ->c+o2
ch4->c+2h2
)

[engineerdude]

Originally Posted by Michaelangelica

'Sigh'

I despair of people who say 'not enough research has been done]

More than enough research has been done. People currently have nothing to do with global climate. On the other hand, we destroy coral, pollute rivers, erode topsoil, plenty of very real things. You are wasting your time and effort with imaginary problems like global warming. And you are in fact hurting the planet by diverting money and energy to pretend-issues things like AGW, instead of actually helping our world be better. In my opinion.

And I will be happy to continue trying to convince you all of this, people I respect, and who's opinions I value.

[engineerdude]

Originally Posted by belovelife

yes at which point itaccelerates the methane molecule that is currently in a gel like state, o the point of releasing a gas, the amount of this gas added to the atmoshere would hold more of the suns energy in the atmoshere
i think when it gets a 5 degree temp change here in sd where i live we are expecting something like 130f average days
if so, i would ned to fix my air conditioner
(or build an ionic breese the size of several skyscrapers to
co2 ->c+o2
ch4->c+2h2
)

This isn't how our world works. There is no energy trapped or "held" in our atmosphere. The greenhouse effect is like a blanket around our planet - it does not trap energy, it just slows the movement of heat, both coming in and going out. Again, there is no significant energy trapped any place in the atmosphere - changes in air composition just make heat move faster or slower. The only part of the sun's energy that is actually held on earth is that from chemical processes or photosynthesis. The rest of the energy is just moved around and eventually radiated back out to space. The greenhouse effect has no ability to hold any energy.

[belovelife]

although i cannot agree with that statement
a cannot give a definate argument to define the effects
now as far as us heating, well regardless of why we are heating
we are heating
just look at the noah satelite images for the past 30 years
and you will the the fact that the ice sheets are melting
so much so that there is international territorial pissings going on
for the new ocean pass between europe and russia vian the arctic
now this has been in the news, since enough of the ice cap has melted
there is a path that goes thrue the arctic now (above canada)
year long, now if this warming trend continues to the 0 point
then less of the sun's radiation will be bounced back into space via the ice caps
now exactly what this means, i don't know
all i know is its not good
the amount of growing food land would be limited to the most norther and most southern territories, the equitorial region would be way to hot