Agricultural recycling

[Ganoderma]

before thinking big, i am thinking we could put our heads together for some processes that will elimate waste and focus it into something useful, but start small in a garden setting.

i see food production (plant) as we only take one thing out....corn (seed), potato (root), lettuce (leaves) etc.

there is a lot of waste that is often thrown out or burned (yuck!).

so we have this big plant,lets take corn for a second. we got a few cobs of corn off it but we now have a fairly woody stem, a bunch of leaves and the roots. i see a lot of locked up energy in there that is jsut going to be "wasted".


what i aim for is some kind of system, lets think of something, that takes up around 10% or less of teh growing space and turns green energy (waste material of plants) into brown energy (compost? fertilizer, soil additives).

i am thinking for now not concern about climate etc, work on that later. but for focus on trying to convert waste material into soil/poo or whatever that can be thrown back out into the field....doesn't even have to be good nutrition, just not bad....add to the soil at the very least. the goal is to stop wasting and burning, and reuse it in the garden/farm.....without attracting pests. and hopefully in a timely fashion without large surface area requirements.


leaves seem rather easily taken care of as they are eaten up by animals and fungus fast. but the cellulose heavy things like stems and roots (very hard) are often slow to break down. i have played a bit with mushrooms to break down these parts faster, but was a little disappointed in the final result (still rather woody and takes a long time for other organisms (bug) to break down further).

my personal belief is that if a system like this can eventually be refined to little space, fast turnover and efficiency, than self sustained agriculture that is lighter on the planet is probably an easy task.

thoughts?



some random links sort of related.
recycling wood
http://www.for.gov.bc.ca/hfd/library...BC1996MR19.pdf

National Compost Trials: British Columbia Use of Organic Composts in Horticultural Production Systems
Composting Council of Canada


basic gardener type thing
http://www.westchestergov.com/pdfs/E...Composting.pdf

Compost Microorganisms
Compost Microorganisms

[Turtle]

Originally Posted by Ganoderma

before thinking big, i am thinking we could put our heads together for some processes that will elimate waste and focus it into something useful, but start small in a garden setting.
...
leaves seem rather easily taken care of as they are eaten up by animals and fungus fast. but the cellulose heavy things like stems and roots (very hard) are often slow to break down. i have played a bit with mushrooms to break down these parts faster, but was a little disappointed in the final result (still rather woody and takes a long time for other organisms (bug) to break down further).

thoughts?

This is my first year with corn, and I have the stalks laid on the bare garden soil to start composting and control erosion. Tough stuff aright. The root balls and lower stems of my sunflowers, which I have grown several years, also don't break down very fast. Nonetheless, I don't care to pay for the yard debris service so it is all still in the "takes-long-to-break-down-pile", which I keep separate from several smaller compost piles I use for the leafy goods from the garden and yard.

My thought at the moment is to grind it up before composting. That's another cost for a machine, cost to run it, pollution if it's gas driven, and maybe not enough oomph if it's electric. Not sure what's on the market, just throwing out the idea.

[Ganoderma]

yes, that is certainly a good idea, and it is done a lot. there was a place where i lived in canada that turned wood debris (fallen trees, pruned trees etc) into soil within 4 weeks. it used a few things, mostly grinding and heat....but like you say its using a lot of energy itself, which i want to avoid when possible.

i am trying to setup an experiment with oyster mushrooms and chopsticks (bamboo) and see how much it actually breaks down in XX days, by volume and dry weight. but that takes time, so after christmas.

i was thinking that a multi processed unit would be a must. for example, first you need to dry it (that takes up a lot of space), but once dried i was thinking perhaps a mushroom culture (good money in that as well), then when they are spent try that parabolic trough (sp?) that you posted a while ago, but on a big scale. grinding may be the best option i think, which means energy used....perhaps solar is enough to power, not sure....a wood grinder just sounds expensive, so i have not looked into it lol. for my experiments out kitchen blender gets good use

What are some things that are known to break down cell structures in a big way?
heat
UV
freezing (best done while plants are still green)
mechanically crushing/grinding

more ideas?


another link for a little more info
http://www.davidsuzuki.org/files/dos...1_rev1_(2).pdf


WOW! this is really cool!
Beetles That Break Down Wood Might Provide Key to Biofuel Research - Renewable Energy World

"This fungus has genes that then make enzymes," explained Hoover, whose team's findings appeared in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences. "We have been able to detect messages from the [fungal] DNA, which get translated into enzymes."

i should ask the kids to bring home some asian long horns to play with



http://www.fungifun.org/mushworld/Oy...hapter-5-6.pdf

http://www.pjbs.org/pjnonline/fin196.pdf

[Eclipse Now]

While I love composting, when we are talking about more stubborn agriwaste and even waste timber, I've got a much faster system that can even turn some cardboards and other materials into both a soil enchancement AND some biofuels. Chuck it all in a biochar cooker.

EVERY local government area should turn all their biowaste into a local biochar cooker, if for no other reason than they could generate enough fuel to run their fleet of trucks.

Helps solve global warming, improves the soil EXTREMELY quickly, reduces water and nutrient loss from the soil, adds a "coral reef of the soil" for microorganisms and fungi to grow in which in turn sequesters heaps of Co2 into the soil, and finally... produces some VITAL liquid fuels. Even though oil has crashed under $40 USA this situation will not last. The geology of oil production has not changed, and we will be facing oil shortages within the decade.

For more on Biochar see this thread.

[Ganoderma]

that thought crossed my mind as well. what kind of system do you propose?

i have also just realized the huge amount of post harvest pine apples, which have NO use it seems, they just dry and burn the plants.

i am wondering if there is perhaps a way of making a portable or mobile system of this "biochar" cooker, one that can be taken farm to farm....because lets face it, hauling millions of truckloads of agriwaste is just not realistic.

edit. i have been reading a bit now and found this neat bit.

http://www.biochar-international.org...rprojects.html

Josh Frye raises a lot of chickens in his poultry operation – as many as 800,000 birds a year. A lot of chickens means a lot of chicken poop to dispose of, along with a lot of propane to keep the chicks warm in the winter - on the order of 30,000 gallons a year. So when a buddy of his, Matt Harper, suggested they take a road trip to Illinois to see a gasifier that would turn poop into heat, Josh was very interested.

i guess i should also mention my wifes parents own a large pig farm, so should the right things come along, i have quite a lot of crap to play with

[Essay]

Sorry I missed this last week....

Originally Posted by Eclipse Now

While I love composting....
Helps solve global warming, improves the soil EXTREMELY quickly, reduces water and nutrient loss from the soil, adds a "coral reef of the soil" for microorganisms and fungi to grow in which in turn sequesters heaps of Co2 into the soil, and finally... produces some VITAL liquid fuels.

googled: "coral reef of the soil"

Hey! I just googled this and it seems this is a phrase you coined!

I think it is very descriptive and easily lends a very intuitive grasp of the potential for biochar.

I'm going to start using that phrase when I try to explain biochar to folks.
...if that's okay?
===

...of course now I'm suspecting that the real coral reefs are probably releasing a lot of CO2 as they bleach.
...all the more reason to build up our terrestrial "coral reefs."

~

p.s. ...and great idea. I think the mobile pyrolysis units have a lot of potential!!!
...except where trash trucks can ferry stuff to a central location....

[Ganoderma]

just read this (i gotta go to work i 20 mins )

http://www.biochar-international.org...production.pdf

Gasification and pyrolysis production systems can be developed
as mobile or stationary units. Small scale gasification and pyrolysis
systems that can be used on farm or by small industries are
commercially available with biomass inputs of 50 kg/hr to 1,000
kg/hr. At the local or regional level, pyrolysis and gasification units
can be operated by co-operatives or larger industries, and have
processed up to 8,000 kg of biomass per hour.

8,000 KG/HR is quite frankly an incredibly impressive number. but it doesn't give other figures about that system like how big it is.

i also think that 50kg/hr for a portable unit is quite fair. setup up a unit at a farm for a day or 2, let them dispose of all their gunk, and move down the road to the next farm....sounds pretty sweet to me! but i am having trouble finding the general concept of how this works and how to build one (the ones for sale are REALLY expensive!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

i guess my jars of mold i have growing are not really that useful as i originally though LOL!

[JMJones0424]

One thing I think is missing in the "environmental" approach to agriculture is the value of crop wastes. Do a search for the nutrient value of hay removed from grasslands, as these are the most documented effects of total crop removal from the local environment. The notion that you can remove all of the biomass created in a season without detrimental effect on the soil health is flat out wrong.

Hard to decompose products like corn stalks and stover can be reintroduced to the soil after composting, but this is relatively expensive. A more efficient way is to use this material as supplemental feed to livestock, and to reincorporate their waste back into the field crops. There are of course many variables in this approach, and no one solution fits all applications.

Ultimately, I think the notion that effective cropland management without livestock is flawed at its root, and trying to maintain a nutrient recycling regimine without livestock is economically inefficient. There are, however, instances of people using no animals and animal wastes to produce a wide range of plant products, but I'm not convinced of their large scale reliability. That may very well be an inappropriate view on my part.

[Eclipse Now]

Nah, this knowledge is all over the sustainability world. It's just big business doesn't necessarily recognise the longer term costs but even big agricultural players are starting to realise they need to change their ways.

Anyway, we are going to be forced to because we are slowly running out of phosphorus.
Agriculture

Peak phosphorus: readings | Energy Bulletin

But you make a good point about integrating cattle. Check out Cam McKellar's Australian experimentation.
Landline - 10/10/2004: Biological farmers look back to the future . Australian Broadcasting Corp

Then google the book "The Omnivore's dilemma" which suggests other ways to incorporate cattle into a crop farm for a few years, and then you can grow crops there for a few years. It's about intelligently switching markets, but how this works out in practice in an economy is another question. Could it be that individual farms have to get together to co-ordinate who is going to grow what? Communities co-ordinating this way? Or are massive agribusinesses going to corner this method first, simply because they have the money to invest in switching one farm to "growing cows" (as they say here in Australia) and another to growing crops?... and then back again after a few years?

[HydrogenBond]

Even hard to decompose products are good for the soil. It adds air gaps in the soil that are beneficial to a good root system. Over time they will slowly decompose. That is why bark mulch is often added to potting soils. It is not there for nutrients, but aeration. It makes it harder to compact the soil and helps the soil retain water. But as time goes on, it also breaks down to add soil amenities.

One approach, that is not often used, is to find the fastest growing plants that can grow on the worse land. These are often weeds. We might be able to compost this material, if we can kill the seeds, and use the weed compost, to enrich other soil that is used for food crops.