[tarak]

The four elements proposed by our ancient philosophers are earth,fire,water and ether.I feel there are only two elements in the form of four ( matter,energy,time and space).Just for the sake of it what should be the basic elements of modern perception???

T.Dhurjati

[Fishteacher73]

It seems that we understand that matter and energy are linked and just differnt forms of the same stuff. So mass and energy should be lumped together. Distance would be another of the base elements (It really cannot be reduced into any other concept). Time woulld be the other factor. From these any other info could be derrived. These would be the basic element of anything.

[Tormod]

I think it could be argued that time is not an element but a result of a change in the energy.

[Fishteacher73]

Time is a bit odd. It is relative in relation to velocity, but velocity if a function of distance/tiime. So time is used in defining what time is (mathematically that is).

[Turtle]

___Mmmmm...don't we call that begging the question in logic.

___Buckmister Fuller was a lover of 4; witness his extensive work in tetrahedral space. Native Americans have their Four Directions. Then we have to mention the Four Humors, ie. body fluids.. Let;s see... blood, 2 different colors of bile, & something else.
___Since any attempt to classify everything into to some arbitrarily small group relies on the concept of 1, ie. unity, any such arrangement over unity is itself arbitrary.

[maddog]

Originally Posted by tarak

The four elements proposed by our ancient philosophers are earth,fire,water and ether.I feel there are only two elements in the form of four ( matter,energy,time and space).Just for the sake of it what should be the basic elements of modern perception???

T.Dhurjati

Tarak,

The four elements (I've heard it as "earth, air, water, fire") map nicely to the four states of matter
(think phase) as {solid, liquid, gas, plasma}. The last state is when you only have nuclei with all electrons
as free electrons and not in any bound state. In fact the Chinese added a fith element "wood". I guess
then you consider living things as a phase (gets kinda' weird).

I think your example interdepend on each other. Matter can be converted to Energy. Time and Space
can be conjoined into SpaceTime. So speaking alchemically (as these ancient philosophers did), the states
of matter I mentioned above would suffice.

Now as to what is the basic elements of modern perception, I guess that would be the force forces of
Nature: EM, Weak, Strong, Gravity. These are the modern expressors by which we view and interact
with the world. I guess that is what you mean.

Maddog

[kaelcarp]

When you boil everything down, you end up with only one real element: existence. The existence of electrons and other particles in particular places or doing particular things determines just about everything else.

You could say that the idea of elements is just our limited minds trying to make sense of that.

[C1ay]

Originally Posted by tarak

The four elements proposed by our ancient philosophers are earth,fire,water and ether.I feel there are only two elements in the form of four ( matter,energy,time and space).Just for the sake of it what should be the basic elements of modern perception???

T.Dhurjati

I think there is matter and space. Energy is a group term for the forces of nature, i.e. gravity, electric, etc. so it is not an element. Time is the chronology of events, not a direct element of those events or their matter.

[TeleMad]

Originally Posted by C1ay

There are only 10 kinds of people in the world -- those who understand binary, and those who don't.

Did you hear? Bill Gates is trying to patent 1's and 0's! You might have to pay M$ to use your signature soon!

[C1ay]

Originally Posted by TeleMad

Did you hear? Bill Gates is trying to patent 1's and 0's! You might have to pay M$ to use your signature soon!

I'll worry about that if SCO wins their cases against IBM and Novell. I won't hold my breath waiting for either though