What is proof?

[Qfwfq]

No, Pyrotex, it is not that simple.

Originally Posted by Pyrotex

One wonders what the Catholic prelates and cardinals of the 16th Century felt when confronted by Galileo's outrageous evidence that the Earth went around the sun.

Many of them, including the Pope that later had him under the Inquisition, agreed with him very much, despite the fact that evidence was far from outrageous at the time.

Hard to believe?

[Pyrotex]

Originally Posted by Qfwfq

No, Pyrotex, it is not that simple. Many of them, including the Pope that later had him under the Inquisition, agreed with him...

What!?!?!?!? I was promised simplicity. It's here in my contract.
Seriously, I believe you are correct, for the most part. Weren't there TWO Popes involved in this rucus?

[Qfwfq]

The Pope changed, but the one before Urban wasn't as much involved. I'll look if I have a bit of time at home.

[Pyrotex]

Originally Posted by Qfwfq

The Pope changed, but the one before Urban wasn't as much involved. I'll look if I have a bit of time at home.

Yes, Urban it was. The one before him must have been Suburban.
I remember seeing the the historical docu-drama on Galileo about a year ago. Urban was a cardinal and Galileo approached him with his discoveries. Urban was mostly agreeable though cautiously. Galileo took this as encouragement which it may NOT have been. Urban became Pope. Galileo tried to use Urban as a "reference" and Urban took umbrage at this. Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition.

[the romantic cynic]

Originally Posted by Pyrotex

No, summer, it is not that simple.
Evolution is already "in" the classroom because it has successfully explained the order of the biological realm without resorting to superstition or the supernatural. Science is impossible if you resort to the supernatural. It isn't "science" then. It is religion.
The Theory of Evolution has as much "proof" as the Theory of Gravity. We know "how" gravity works, but we don't know (yet) what "makes" it work. This is no excuse to teach school kids they can jump from the roofs of their houses.
The "proverbial tantrum" you spoke of, in fact, never happened. Not in the schoolrooms where ID was debated, nor in the courtrooms where it was kept out of the schoolroom.
Evolution has massive evidence on its side. ID has NO evidence at all. None. Not the first shadow of a glimmer of a shred of evidence.

One wonders what the Catholic prelates and cardinals of the 16th Century felt when confronted by Galileo's outrageous evidence that the Earth went around the sun. They felt like you feel, summer.

like i said before evidence should never be confused with proof.

"a lack of evidence of one belief is not conclusive proof to the contrary" therefore. i neither can be proven neither should be taught. and you're right, it is most certainly not simple. that would be the one point. that i would recall everything else i say still stands.

[Pyrotex]

Originally Posted by the romantic cynic

like i said before evidence should never be confused with proof. ...

But as stated in other posts, "proof" does not exist, not as the tangible, palpable, solid thing you are demanding. ALL we have is evidence and logic. that is all we will ever have. Since you will exclude ANYTHING and EVERYTHING in the Universe as NOT PROOF, therefore your mind is closed. You are willfully blind and you sound like you are arrogant about it as well.
[sigh]
I'm sure your God is very proud of you.

[the romantic cynic]

Originally Posted by Pyrotex

But as stated in other posts, "proof" does not exist, not as the tangible, palpable, solid thing you are demanding. ALL we have is evidence and logic. that is all we will ever have. Since you will exclude ANYTHING and EVERYTHING in the Universe as NOT PROOF, therefore your mind is closed. You are willfully blind and you sound like you are arrogant about it as well.
[sigh]
I'm sure your God is very proud of you.

first of all your sarcasm is hurtfull,
i am not demanding proof, i know it does not exist, i am merely pointing it out.
even if i did not believe in God, evolution would make no sense to me.
also beware if you mind is too open you brain might fall out,(sigh)
i'm sure you're very proud of youself

[Pyrotex]

Originally Posted by the romantic cynic

first of all your sarcasm is hurtfull

I apologize.

i am not demanding proof, i know it does not exist, i am merely pointing it out. even if i did not believe in God, evolution would make no sense to me.

Okay, but that may be a limitation of your education, your culture, or the family environment you grew up in. Some people have attempted to "prove" evolution is stupid because THEY couldn't understand it. But there are a lot of perfectly valid things that lots of us don't understand.

beware if you mind is too open you brain might fall out. (sigh)
i'm sure you're very proud of yourself

OH!! You got me!!! Touche! Goodbye, cruel world... aarrrrggghhhhhh.... [flop]

[the romantic cynic]

pyrotex, it is obvious that we will never come top a conclusion. i will never change you and you will never change me.

with that i leave you to your evolutionary theories.


sincerely
summer

[Pyrotex]

Originally Posted by the romantic cynic

...i leave you to your evolutionary theories.

bye summer. best of luck with your religious beliefs. take care.
sincerely, px