Heim Theory

[Khan N. Singh]

Originally Posted by Pyrotex

Not really. I was dividing the size of an electron by the time it took a mu meson to disappear. Those are unrelated phenomena. It just so happened that the one was smallest time and the other the smallest distance ever measured.

so how do you explain the resulting velocity? what is it a velocity of?

[TheFaithfulStone]

Returning to the original topic, this forum has a good discussion, and also a link to a pretty easy paper about Heim Theory.

http://forum.physorg.com/index.php?showtopic=4385&st=15

Link is in the first post.

Heim Theory has some uncomfortable implications, like that quarks may not exsist as sub-sub atomic particles, and that the universe didn't start in a "big bang" with the creation of matter, but rather in a hole crap load of "little bangs" all over an already extremely large universe.

I've said before that I have my doubts as to the correctness of this theory, but it has something that M-Theory and (especially) the Standard Model lack, which is one of the those forehead slapping - "duh!" insights.

Einstein says "Gravity is the effect of mass on the structure of space time itself."

Heim says "Not just, gravity, but every force and every thing. In fact, everything is pretty much made of specially modulated nothing."

It requires a SINGLE fundamental "stuff" (the metronic lattice) and it square pretty nicely with a lot of observations.

I think Heim may be on to something there with his "fundamental geometrization" of space-time and physics itself.

TFS

edit: Bad Astronomy also has some pretty good posts on it. At least one person devotes a fair amount of time to debunking it - fairly effectively, but not totally.

[Pyrotex]

Originally Posted by Khan N. Singh

so how do you explain the resulting velocity? what is it a velocity of?

The ratio of those two measurements was very nearly ... the speed of light itself. "c"

The meaning is this: IF there is a Metron, the smallest distance (Space is quantized)

and IF there is a Chronon, the smallest span of time (Time is quantized)

Then at the speed of light, the fastest speed possible in OUR universe,

You are traveling at one Metron per Chronon.

Peddle to the metal, Francois, and don't dodge the pedestrians.

[TheFaithfulStone]

See, it's things like that which make me suspect that quantized space-time is on to something.

All basic principles of the universe, should (in an elegant fashion) result from extraordinary simplicity which gives rise to unbelievable complexity.

The other thing that bothers me about Heim Theory is that quarks shouldn't exsist, at least in the six dimensional version.

TFS

[arkain101]

Ya ought to check out this topic.. it smells good.
2D vs 3D Space...

nearing my last post is relating this concept to gravity.

[TheFaithfulStone]

Found me a deal breaker.

Heim predicts the spead of gravity to be 4/3c. Which it ain't. It's c. (or actually 1.1c +- .15 = (which to mean means it's c, dammit.)

I wonder if there is way to reconcile his prediction of graviton speed with experimental data, and if this prediction makes the rest of his math fall apart.

Still, the mass predictions are pretty interesting.

TFS

[Ahsmohdean]

I have been doing alot of reading on this subject in the last few days, seems alot of people have. Often the statement that a suggested experiment is mentioned with regards that it should be carried out to prove or disprove this heim theory. A experiment that involves realy realy strong electromagnetic fields and may produce anti gravity particles and posibly shift matter into higher dimentions. And it all sounds realy familiar to me. Of course the Navy denies it ever happened. I just find it funny that it sounds alot like the Philidelphia experiment, which if there is any truth to it at all was supposedly conducted before heim even made his theory. Anyways they try to use realy powerfull electromagnetic fields to degause i think is the word they use (make the ship not attract mines), and it ended up traveling several hundred miles in seconds and possibly into and through other dimentions. I just got a laugh out of all this recent heim theory stuff, when i read it because it seems this experiment was already carried out before the theory was made, and did produce the results he descibes. Of course there is no proof whatsoever about the Philidelphia experiment, all that remains is he said she said, some books and a movie.

[TheFaithfulStone]

Uh... okay.

The idea that electromagnetism and gravity are somehow related is pretty common - but mostly it's just wishful thinking. I am sure that they ARE in fact somehow related - (imagine electroweak theory) but I kinda doubt that their relationship implies an ability to affect one with the other.

ALSO. Other dimension != parallel universe where c > c or any other such ridiculous thing. A three dimensional universe is one in which you can describe the location of any point with three numbers. A four dimension universe can be described with four numbers, etc. A six dimensional theory means that there are six numbers needed to describe a point in six dimensional space, not that there is a parallel universe with talking dragons and Red Lectroids.

Now, the way you "travel in an alternate dimension" in Heim theory is not "slipping into a different space time." it's exactly that - if your position is decribed by six numbers, you can change the numbers for dimensions four and five. Heim postulates (and indeed calculates) that changing the coordinates in dimensions five and six also has an effect on dimensions 1-4. So it's not that "c" is faster in 5D or anything like that, it's that "distance" is the wrong concept. You can change your "aeonic" coordinate, and that nesscitates a change you your "normal" 4D coordinates.

At least, that's the way I read it. But that makes a lot more sense than alternate universes with John Lithgow as an alien. (Especially since that's true in THIS universe.)

TFS

edit: Actually, that's not really what he says either. You do this thing with the spinning toroid of "not-yetium" and you gain the ability to manipulate your "aeonic" (or whatever, I don't remember) coordinate, when you change this you change the rest of them as well, but since you are not acting on the first four dimensions (the ones where pesky rules like relativity apply) you're not subject to said pesky rules, and you can go as fast as the fifth dimension will allow.

[aaronearl]

Originally Posted by TheFaithfulStone

Found me a deal breaker.

Heim predicts the spead of gravity to be 4/3c. Which it ain't. It's c. (or actually 1.1c +- .15 = (which to mean means it's c, dammit.)

I wonder if there is way to reconcile his prediction of graviton speed with experimental data, and if this prediction makes the rest of his math fall apart.

Still, the mass predictions are pretty interesting.

TFS

Have the speed of gravitons actually been measured and found to agree with the predictions of G.R.? I know that I'm no physicist, but the last thing I heard about such things was an attempt to build a detector that would measure the flux of this type of radiation, associated with other types of stellar events... but not the properties of the gravitons, themselves.

Actually, can you fill me in on the present experimental tests of G.R.?

Thanks.

[Pyrotex]

Originally Posted by aaronearl

Have the speed of gravitons actually been measured and found to agree with the predictions of G.R.? I know that I'm no physicist, but the last thing I heard about such things was an attempt to build a detector that would measure the flux of this type of radiation, associated with other types of stellar events... but not the properties of the gravitons, themselves.
...

Okay, I am not the expert you are looking for. He is the ONE who shall come after me, and whose shoelaces I am unworthy to tie... uh... sorry. I got carried away.
Back to your question. As far as I have read in the past decade, no one has actually no-kidding detected a graviton or gravitational radiation. There is an experiment to do so with a pair of L shaped laser vacuum chambers (interferometers), but they are still learning to filter out noise. One facility is in Louisiana, the other up in the NW somewhere. Last I read, they were still a factor of 10 or 100 away from their required sensitivity.

And another thing--the speed of gravitational radiation, Vg, is (I think) assumed to be the same as light (c) because gravitational fields themselves do not have mass. Therefore, they are manifested by massless "particles", therefore they travel at c. Massive particles MUST travel slower than c, since they suffer from all that Lorentz-Fitzgerald poop as they approach c. But I do not remember anybody claiming that gravity HAD to travel or has been PROVED to travel at c. It could travel at 4/3 * PI * c as far as I know. Or c / PI. The latter would be a real bummer, as it might mean we will never travel faster than light.