Differences Between Conservatives and Liberals

[questor]

I have been accused on this site of being a closet liberal. This ,of course, has severely hurt my feelings and caused some of my closest friends to question my sanity as well as fealty to the cause of trying to make a better world. In order to clear the air, as well as my restore my reputation, I would like to offer some links and dicussion on the differences between conservatives and liberals so that those who are preparing to vote in the November election can better understand the philosophy of the candidates and party they are voting for. I trust this discussion will be civil and rewarding for both sides. The link is at the end of the posting.

THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN LIBERALS AND CONSERVATIVES: #1
Fiscal and social differences between Conservatives and Liberals:

''Conservatives believe in lowering taxes for all tax payers. Obviously, those who pay higher taxes will get the biggest break with an even percentage. Example, Mr. Smith makes $100,000.00 a year and his taxes are cut by $2500.00 while Mr. Jones makes $50,000.00 a year are cut by $1,250.00 The percentage is the same. The one who earns more gets more back. Common sense...

THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN LIBERALS AND CONSERVATIVES: #2
Conservatives want a smaller, less intrusive government. Allow people to do what they want as long as it’s within the law.
Liberals want more control over the people. They want to limit as many rights as possible and keep control over all sorts of behavior...

THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN LIBERALS AND CONSERVATIVES: #3
Education is always a hot topic. Democrats were in charge of education for more than 40 years, complaining during every election about the need for more funding. They got more funding every year, compliments of the tax payers. Education in this country is in a sorry state these days. Pouring money on a school doesn’t improve anything but a few bank accounts.
Conservatives believe that education should be a matter of parental choice, not societal formulas...

THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN LIBERALS AND CONSERVATIVES: #4
Welfare is another sore subject, every election year. Conservatives believe in helping people get on their feet. If a single parent or family is in financial trouble beyond their ability to manage, Welfare is a good safety net. It was never intended to be a permanent lifestyle!...

THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN LIBERALS AND CONSERVATIVES: #5
The differences between Conservatives and Liberals touch every aspect of American life. How about health care? Hillary Clinton wanted to turn one third of the nation’s economy over to a health care system that would have been a nightmare. The liberal approach is to raise taxes and set up a new bureaucracy to choose who gets care and who doesn’t. Canada tried that, by the way. Maybe that’s why so many Canadians come to the US for treatment?...

THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN LIBERALS AND CONSERVATIVES: #6
Race relations are very popular in election years. Liberals love to race-bait at every opportunity. They talk about the poor, down-trodden blacks and how the Republicans are keeping them down. Let’s examine this, shall we? Abraham Lincoln, the first Republican president, freed the slaves. Republicans have fought for civil rights against Democrats and ultimately won. Democrats taunt and insult Conservative black people like J.C.Watts, Colin Powell, Condoleeza Rice and others for being “Uncle Toms”...

THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN LIBERALS AND CONSERVATIVES: #7
The War on Terror is also a big issue. After 9-11, we had to do something to insure that it couldn’t happen again. Kissing terrorist butts hadn’t worked before and it wouldn’t work again...

THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN LIBERALS AND CONSERVATIVES:#8
Abortion is always a “hot button” issue. Liberals have no problem with killing unborn children. They want to spare convicted murderers, terrorists, and enemy combatants, citing that killing is wrong while being in favor of the wholesale slaughter of pre-born children and brain damaged people (euthanasia)...

The link to this information is: The Difference Between Liberals and Conservatives - Associated Content

This gives an idea of one conservatives view of the dichotomy of ideas.
My own view may differ in some respects, I always try to ascertain which course of action is best for society. Shouldn't everyone?

[Moontanman]

Originally Posted by questor

I have been accused on this site of being a closet liberal. This ,of course, has severely hurt my feelings and caused some of my closest friends to question my sanity as well as fealty to the cause of trying to make a better world. In order to clear the air, as well as my restore my reputation, I would like to offer some links and dicussion on the differences between conservatives and liberals so that those who are preparing to vote in the November election can better understand the philosophy of the candidates and party they are voting for. I trust this discussion will be civil and rewarding for both sides. The link is at the end of the posting.

That acusation was done tongue in cheek, but like most conservatives the idea of satire is beyond your comprehension.

THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN LIBERALS AND CONSERVATIVES: #1
Fiscal and social differences between Conservatives and Liberals:

''Conservatives believe in lowering taxes for all tax payers. Obviously, those who pay higher taxes will get the biggest break with an even percentage. Example, Mr. Smith makes $100,000.00 a year and his taxes are cut by $2500.00 while Mr. Jones makes $50,000.00 a year are cut by $1,250.00 The percentage is the same. The one who earns more gets more back. Common sense...

No, liberals do not want to take from the rich and give to the poor, that is a conservative lie. The more you make the more you should be able to afford to pay. $1000 means quite a bit more to a poor man than even $10,000 to a rich man. I know, I've been both very poor and at least upper middle class. I would gladly pay 40% of my wages if I made 2 million dollars a year but 10% of someones wages who makes $25,000 a year is far more hurtful to that person.

THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN LIBERALS AND CONSERVATIVES: #2
Conservatives want a smaller, less intrusive government. Allow people to do what they want as long as it’s within the law.
Liberals want more control over the people. They want to limit as many rights as possible and keep control over all sorts of behavior. Example, cigarettes are still legal, but the liberal “smoking police” try to prevent smokers from even lighting up outdoors. Now the “food police” are going to tell people what they can and can’t eat?

That is such BS! The last few decades show this to be BS, the last 7 years proves it. conservatives want complete control over everything every one does, from stupid drugs wars to sexual orientation Conservatives stay awake at night thinking of more rules to make everyone follow. The government bureaucracy has ballooned under the conservatives and deficit is at an all time high, get real, the conservative party spends like a drunken sailor.

THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN LIBERALS AND CONSERVATIVES: #3
Education is always a hot topic. Democrats were in charge of education for more than 40 years, complaining during every election about the need for more funding. They got more funding every year, compliments of the tax payers. Education in this country is in a sorry state these days. Pouring money on a school doesn’t improve anything but a few bank accounts.
Conservatives believe that education should be a matter of parental choice, not societal formulas...

Again you are full of shit, busing did indeed make for better relations between all peoples. It also made sure that public funds were spent more equally on all schools and not just "white" schools. If parents were all smart enough to know what schools should teach you would have a point but it's obvious they do not in most cases. Private vouchers just take money away from public schools and allow parents to teach their kids religion. If they want to teach religion let them pay it out of their own pockets or maybe bite the bullet and make their children go to church.
Yes we should expect them to be taught well and religion based BS is not the way to go. Parents cannot be trusted to choose what their kids should be taught, times change and what worked in the 1950's is not what will work today.
Public schools are bad because money is not being spent on the things it should be. I was very much active in schools when my sons were coming up and the struggle to keep funds spent on education and not on the school's conservative bureaucracy was almost overwhelming.

THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN LIBERALS AND CONSERVATIVES: #4
Welfare is another sore subject, every election year. Conservatives believe in helping people get on their feet. If a single parent or family is in financial trouble beyond their ability to manage, Welfare is a good safety net. It was never intended to be a permanent lifestyle!...

Conservatives are just as much responsible for the welfare system as the liberals. The welfare system is a compromise of bad ideas from both sides. It allows people to get more money by having more children and it punishes those who want to climb out. Both sides of the fence should ashamed of what they have done to the welfare system.

THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN LIBERALS AND CONSERVATIVES: #5
The differences between Conservatives and Liberals touch every aspect of American life. How about health care? Hillary Clinton wanted to turn one third of the nation’s economy over to a health care system that would have been a nightmare. The liberal approach is to raise taxes and set up a new bureaucracy to choose who gets care and who doesn’t. Canada tried that, by the way. Maybe that’s why so many Canadians come to the US for treatment?...

It takes some real nerve to say what we have now is better than almost anything else. Conservatives don't give shit if anyone has heath care, it was Liberals who pioneered the entire concept. conservatives just want to get rich off sick people and their misery.

THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN LIBERALS AND CONSERVATIVES: #6
Race relations are very popular in election years. Liberals love to race-bait at every opportunity. They talk about the poor, down-trodden blacks and how the Republicans are keeping them down. Let’s examine this, shall we? Abraham Lincoln, the first Republican president, freed the slaves. Republicans have fought for civil rights against Democrats and ultimately won. Democrats taunt and insult Conservative black people like J.C.Watts, Colin Powell, Condoleeza Rice and others for being “Uncle Toms”...

WOW, you paint such a lovely picture of the republican party but do you point out that at the time of Lincoln the Republican party was the party of the Liberals OMFG! Yes times change and the parties have switched places over the years, more than once! If not for the liberals Jim Crow laws would still be in place women would still not be able to vote! And we would not even be able to have a black president much less a woman vice president.

THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN LIBERALS AND CONSERVATIVES: #7
The War on Terror is also a big issue. After 9-11, we had to do something to insure that it couldn’t happen again. Kissing terrorist butts hadn’t worked before and it wouldn’t work again...

This rabid fear mongering will not stand! Our Glorious Fearless Leader lied! He lied, bald faced lies! He went to war against a country that posed no threat to the US, that had no role in the 9/11 attack and he did it with lies and obfuscations, half truths, and BS. People died, tens of thousands of human beings died, because of his lies! He is a lier, nothing more than a common lier whose mouth is as firmly fixed to the middle eastern oil tit as any of the terrorists. Obama has said he will continue the war in Afghanistan and will send more troops and will get Osama. The war in Afghanistan is legitimate, the war in Iraq was a show for Bush to get his rocks off trying to kill the guy who tried to kill his father.

THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN LIBERALS AND CONSERVATIVES:#8
Abortion is always a “hot button” issue. Liberals have no problem with killing unborn children. They want to spare convicted murderers, terrorists, and enemy combatants, citing that killing is wrong while being in favor of the wholesale slaughter of pre-born children and brain damaged people (euthanasia)...


The link to this information is: The Difference Between Liberals and Conservatives - Associated Content

This gives an idea of one conservatives view of the dichotomy of ideas.
My own view may differ in some respects, I always try to ascertain which course of action is best for society. Shouldn't everyone?

Again you lie! Liberals have never been in favor of killing brain damaged people, euthanasia, it is the conservatives who favor this sort of thing, sterilization of the poor, or the mentally ill has long been the domain of the conservative not the liberal. Abortion is something that should be limited but only the woman who wants one should be able to decide that. Yes late term abortions should not be allowed, I would be favor of limits to abortions but not wholesale limits. Conservative values on this would even limit birth control, I guess you want more people to send off to bullshit wars based on lies!

[jackson33]

Moon; You DO understand your arguing with S.L. Bradish, a rather far right and ignorant conservative. I'll argue his opinions later, but your not going to like my arguments or your version of them.

questor; Your the basic 'Limbaugh' conservative. Sometimes, even after 20 years of listening to him, I wonder if he understands there is no one person that can be the conservative he tries to relate to an audience. The down on McCain or the appraisal of Romney, or a realistic approach to illegal immigration or in fact his attitudes on abortion, just a few examples. Roger Hedgecock, a popular substitute (for Limbaugh) and I also enjoy listening to his views, believes planet earth was created 6000 years ago or so... I will later respond to you as well, but wish I knew where you differ from Bradish, as you infered...

[Moontanman]

Originally Posted by jackson33

Moon; You DO understand your arguing with S.L. Bradish, a rather far right and ignorant conservative. I'll argue his opinions later, but your not going to like my arguments or your version of them.

questor; Your the basic 'Limbaugh' conservative. Sometimes, even after 20 years of listening to him, I wonder if he understands there is no one person that can be the conservative he tries to relate to an audience. The down on McCain or the appraisal of Romney, or a realistic approach to illegal immigration or in fact his attitudes on abortion, just a few examples. Roger Hedgecock, a popular substitute (for Limbaugh) and I also enjoy listening to his views, believes planet earth was created 6000 years ago or so... I will later respond to you as well, but wish I knew where you differ from Bradish, as you infered...

I wasn't aware of who he is but what he is seems obvious, I was having fun, I was hoping he would just explode in a shower of sparks if I keep ragging him long enough. Don't worry about what I like, I am used to being wrong, I don't mind it a bit, I am often wrong due to ignorance but never from stupidity like some people we know. I often watch Rush too, I see it as humor, no one could be that stupid with out saying something funny every once in a while! Rush Limbaugh, worst person in the world! I am really not as liberal as some would believe but I am also not conservative, I like to think of myself as somewhat too intelligent to follow anyone without question, doesn't make me right all the time but at least my mistakes are my own!

[questor]

Moon, I am posting links from articles explaining a number of individuals opinions of the difference in thinking of conservatives and liberals. If you disagree, why not post articles proving otherwise?

The differences between Conservatives and Liberals
The interesting part of this article is not the topic (a dispute on drug policy in British Columbia), but the insights into the different moral systems of conservatives and liberals (in the Canadian or American sense). Proffessor Jonathan Haidt, a University of Virginia social psychologist, has developed a system to explain the different moral systems of conservatives and liberals.

In his view there are five foundations people use to define morality:

Harm: whether someone is harmed or harm is reduced.
Reciprocity: whether something is fair and treats people fairly and justly.
In-group: whether something betrays the group.
Hierarchy: whether something is respectful of authority and superiors.
Purity: whether or not something is disgusting.
Haidt says that Liberals only use the first two - and don't respond to arguments based on the other three, while conservatives use all five, and therefore will find arguments based solely on the first two unconvincing. There could be a real lesson for political communications here.

In my opinion, a liberal society culminates in a socialistic society , which seems to destroy a persons ability to succeed according to his ambitions and aspirations. Do we want to live in a socialistic society, or in one that gives free rein to a person's abilities? I have never talked to a business owner who would choose socialism.

[Moontanman]

Originally Posted by questor

Moon, I am posting links from articles explaining a number of individuals opinions of the difference in thinking of conservatives and liberals. If you disagree, why not post articles proving otherwise?

The differences between Conservatives and Liberals
The interesting part of this article is not the topic (a dispute on drug policy in British Columbia), but the insights into the different moral systems of conservatives and liberals (in the Canadian or American sense). Proffessor Jonathan Haidt, a University of Virginia social psychologist, has developed a system to explain the different moral systems of conservatives and liberals.

In his view there are five foundations people use to define morality:

Harm: whether someone is harmed or harm is reduced.
Reciprocity: whether something is fair and treats people fairly and justly.
In-group: whether something betrays the group.
Hierarchy: whether something is respectful of authority and superiors.
Purity: whether or not something is disgusting.
Haidt says that Liberals only use the first two - and don't respond to arguments based on the other three, while conservatives use all five, and therefore will find arguments based solely on the first two unconvincing. There could be a real lesson for political communications here.

In my opinion, a liberal society culminates in a socialistic society , which seems to destroy a persons ability to succeed according to his ambitions and aspirations. Do we want to live in a socialistic society, or in one that gives free rein to a person's abilities? I have never talked to a business owner who would choose socialism.

I my opinion, a conservative society culminates in a fascist society. Manipulating the population by lies, and fear mongering is no way to run a government. If you disagree I suggest you vote republican, I will vote for someone who's policies do not support telling lies that result in war and death. We are total odds with each other, I withdraw from the discussion, you win the battle I will win the war.

[questor]

Moon, before you run away, take a look at these stats:

American Battle Deaths Recent Wars:

Second World War....291,557- Pres. at beginning, F.D. Roosevelt, Democrat

Korean War......33,741- Pres. at beginning , Truman, Democrat

Vietnam War.....47,424- Pres. at beginning, Johnson, Democrat

Current War.... 4,093- Pres. at beginning, Bush, Republican

The way I read this, an American is much less likely to lose his life under a Republican president.

[Essay]

Originally Posted by questor

Moon, before you run away, take a look at these stats:

American Battle Deaths Recent Wars:

Second World War....291,557- Pres. at beginning, F.D. Roosevelt, Democrat

Korean War......33,741- Pres. at beginning , Truman, Democrat

Vietnam War.....47,424- Pres. at beginning, Johnson, Democrat

Current War.... 4,093- Pres. at beginning, Bush, Republican

The way I read this, an American is much less likely to lose his life under a Republican president.

I think this is just an example of war deaths decreasing with time (& with increasing war technology and medical knowledge); but unrelated to administration. If you go further back in time (like the Civil War, -Repub.) the death toll is even greater, into the millions, I think.

[Galapagos]

Originally Posted by questor

Moon, before you run away, take a look at these stats:

American Battle Deaths Recent Wars:

Second World War....291,557- Pres. at beginning, F.D. Roosevelt, Democrat

Korean War......33,741- Pres. at beginning , Truman, Democrat

Vietnam War.....47,424- Pres. at beginning, Johnson, Democrat

Current War.... 4,093- Pres. at beginning, Bush, Republican

The way I read this, an American is much less likely to lose his life under a Republican president.

The decrease in casualties of war and violence in general has little to do with the parties in office. Steven Pinker elaborates in his article "AHistory of Violence":
Edge 206-A HISTORY OF VIOLENCE
by Steven Pinker

Originally Posted by Pinker

At the century scale, it is hard to find quantitative studies of deaths in warfare spanning medieval and modern times.
[...]
Social histories of the West provide evidence of numerous barbaric practices that became obsolete in the last five centuries, such as slavery, amputation, blinding, branding, flaying, disembowelment, burning at the stake, breaking on the wheel, and so on. Meanwhile, for another kind of violence—homicide—the data are abundant and striking. The criminologist Manuel Eisner has assembled hundreds of homicide estimates from Western European localities that kept records at some point between 1200 and the mid-1990s. In every country he analyzed, murder rates declined steeply—for example, from 24 homicides per 100,000 Englishmen in the fourteenth century to 0.6 per 100,000 by the early 1960s.

On the scale of decades, comprehensive data again paint a shockingly happy picture: Global violence has fallen steadily since the middle of the twentieth century. According to the Human Security Brief 2006, the number of battle deaths in interstate wars has declined from more than 65,000 per year in the 1950s to less than 2,000 per year in this decade. In Western Europe and the Americas, the second half of the century saw a steep decline in the number of wars, military coups, and deadly ethnic riots.

Zooming in by a further power of ten exposes yet another reduction. After the cold war, every part of the world saw a steep drop-off in state-based conflicts, and those that do occur are more likely to end in negotiated settlements rather than being fought to the bitter end. Meanwhile, according to political scientist Barbara Harff, between 1989 and 2005 the number of campaigns of mass killing of civilians decreased by 90 percent.

A video for those interested in Pinker's argument:
Steven Pinker on the myth of violence | Video on TED.com

[jackson33]

Originally Posted by Essay

I think this is just an example of war deaths decreasing with time (& with increasing war technology and medical knowledge); but unrelated to administration. If you go further back in time (like the Civil War, -Repub.) the death toll is even greater, into the millions, I think.

Its estimated 618k died on both sides of the CW, 213k from battle. FDR still holds the record for US deaths in WWII, with a little over a million US casualties (killed/wounded) and estimates up to 40/50 millions from all sides. Russian/German/American/Japanese...The CW was the highest US percentage of population, just under 2%. You might consider the reasons...

Moon; I would think lies by politicians and/or government or the manipulation of a people, should include the war on poverty. Poor people, much of the Black population have been told government will care for them by a select few since 1965 (43-44 years), while the rhetoric continues most of those same families remain in poverty, waiting for the results. Wouldn't it have been better then to demand something for the assistance, like getting a job, getting married, going to school or something....