Subliminal perception

[C1ay]

Originally Posted by bumab

Check out the ice on the front of soda machines sometimes (those big, close up ice cubes). I'm pretty sure there's at least one curvy woman hidden in each machine picture...

Does that really work though? If it did would it make more women or less women buy a coke?

[bumab]

I don't know if it would work... probably, based on the fact that Victoria's Secret uses nearly naked women to market to women.

[C1ay]

Originally Posted by bumab

I don't know if it would work... probably, based on the fact that Victoria's Secret uses nearly naked women to market to women.

And that's an interesting point that brings up a tangent to the main topic. I think it is fairly obvious that Victoria's Secret is using sexually suggestive subliminal persuasion to market to women.

This reminds me of another phenomenon I've noticed in the checkout aisle at the grocery store. Nearly every magazine aimed at women suggests sex on the cover in one way or another. They all have headlines like "Please him tonight", "X number of new positions to try" or "Find his magic G spot", etc. A cursory glanc at the magazines aimed at men reveals nothing of the same. They all hint at something like "Make your car faster", "Shoot Straighter" or "Catch bigger fish". We you take it all in as a whole you get the impression that women spend more time thinking about sex than men do. For some reason my real life experiences just don't carry the same message.

It's blatantly obvious that marketers are trying to use subliminal persuasion everywhere. I wonder how much it really works though. I imagine that stores like Victoria's Secret do get a little more business from women who think they need their products to look more attractive. I imagine they also get a little more business from men that want their women to be more enticing. OTOH, as soon as my men's wear outlet starts parading sexy men around the store I think I'll do my shopping elsewhere. I think this would probably chase off most of their other clients as well, except for the gay ones. To this end I guess there is some effect of subliminal influence. Sex sells. Does it really appeal to women more than men though? That's the real question

[pgrmdave]

I think that there is more pressure on women to be more sexually attractive, because it is more appealing to men. In order to find a mate, women must be more sexually attractive, while men don't have that same pressure. On the other hand, men must be seen as good providers, so we have more pressure to seem successful, socially and financially. Which is why we want the fast cars, and thousands of gadgets - on a biological level, they make us seem more successful, thus better providers for our offspring.

[Fishteacher73]

While a bit off thread, I think it bears some connection. This was brought up by my father one day (a petrophysicist). He noted that many people assume that their peer group is a reasonable representaion of the population as a whole. Unfortunately I think the peer group here (as well as most of us probably have outside of here) is more than likely very skewed from the actual "norm". Just as my father had noted that most of his peers had PhD's or masters degrees, that is not representaional of the educational level of the "average Joe".

I bring this up in terms of how we (meaning our peer group, and not the ubiquitous "we") are influenced less by both the overt ploys (buy this cigarette...it will make you popular) and the more subtle images and messages (possible subliminal) because we recognize them. With this acknowledgement, they become much less effective. Much like having heard a joke before. You may giggle, but it isn't as funny as the first time.

[C1ay]

Originally Posted by Fishteacher73

I bring this up in terms of how we (meaning our peer group, and not the ubiquitous "we") are influenced less by both the overt ploys (buy this cigarette...it will make you popular) and the more subtle images and messages (possible subliminal) because we recognize them. With this acknowledgement, they become much less effective. Much like having heard a joke before. You may giggle, but it isn't as funny as the first time.

Wondering off topic like yourself, I believe this has been shown to be the reason people with scientific interests like our group are harder to hypnotise. In general, we are a more skeptical group than the average Joe.

[orbsycli]

not only with words can music have a subliminal significance.
i will use this song as an example:
radiohead - there there

in the very beginning, the song starts off with drums, and an eerie synth pad to give the song more depth.
i love this song, and when i would talk to my friends about it, they seriously could not hear the pad that rests in the back of the song, but they agreed that even when it was just drums, it "sounded eerie"
and drums themselves can't sound eerie...well unless they are like distant huge pounding war drums or something....anyway-
this got me thinking, and i realized something:
your brain hears these sounds, even if you, yourself, don't. and it will affect your body the same way as if you could hear it at a reasonable volume.
this is probably nothing new to you guys, but i found it pretty interesting.

[Fishteacher73]

I think music is the most primitive "language". It probably developed in some sort (rhythmic clacking of two rocks maybe...) before any real spoken language existed. So I think by default musick is purely subliminal. In essence just variation in souldwaves, yet somehow it evokes a feeling. Sometimes slight and basically un-noticed and at other times massive and all consuming. This can all be done WITHOUT LYRICS! Totaly fascinating...

[IrishEyes]

Originally Posted by nemo

i've seen her... there was a point in time when i wanted to be a coke can...

There was a point in time, eh???

As for any type of sublimal suggestions... I am a firm believer. I think I told you guys once about my high school french teacher. The woman was amazing, she knew French, Spanish, Portugese, German, enough Cantonese to live in China, and English, of course. She was an avid linguist, and she had a passion for teaching. When some of her French II students were having a hard time with vocab lists and verb conjugation, she ditched the books and went for a bit of an unorthodox method. We all got our parents to sign a permission slip for 'alternative learning styles', and set out on a journey... Every day before a major test, we pushed all of the desks against the wall, turned out the lights, locked the doors, and laid down on the floor. She would walk us through some deep relaxation techniques and then read of our vocab words, conjugation rules, etc. There was always an 'observer' in the room to make sure it was only educational stuff, so it was rather safe. And would you believe that not a single person got less than a "B" in that class after she started? It was rather amazing. I know it's not exactly the type of subliminal thing you were probably thinking of, but it worked just the same. It wasn't hypnosis, just a series of suggestions and instructions that were given while in a state of total relaxation. It was also the only class that I didn't have text anxiety in.

[Turtle]

___I think just looking at all the post & information on this topic clearly indicates the existence of a subliminal effect. For one thing, if there wasn't some measurable effect the marketers wouldn't be spending money on it. I don't think they have any magic formula or really understand how it works, but rather they put hidden images in the adds & then simply measure response to the add in relation to a normal 'control' add. If it works use it, if not try something else.
___Don't think that having a Phd makes you exempt either. By changing the nature of the sublimal 'icon' to suit different authority figures, anyone is susceptible. I refer you to Stanley Milgrams work on response to authority.