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Old 10-05-2009   #311 (permalink)
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Re: Perpetual motion

I'm quite sure, that anyone constructing a 'perpetual motion machine' ----- using magnets ----- would
not place their magnets so far away, that they become ineffective.
By the way, gravity IS infinite ----- but obviously stronger, nearer 'source'.

Sir Isaac Einstein
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Old 10-05-2009   #312 (permalink)
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Re: Perpetual motion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Isaac Einstein View Post
I'm quite sure, that anyone constructing a 'perpetual motion machine' ----- using magnets ----- would not place their magnets so far away, that they become ineffective.
On the other hand, they would not place their magnets so close that they would cause drag that would cause the machine to stop.

Yes, they'd be placed at just the right distance so that they would have....no effect.

I understand from the other thread you've posted in that you have limited funds, but have you ever worked with even simple magnets? You can do quite a few experiments for just a few dollars of investment.

Unfortunately what you'll find is that the law of the Conservation of Energy applies here and the "force" of magnets, in whatever arrangement result in no motion whatsoever.

What magnets can be made to do is to levitate, and with the application of external energy can induce motion--through alternating electromagnets or propellers or whatever. Even this levitating force however decays over time and is not permanent.

Experimentation or even some research would show this to be the case, but even if you are a skeptic--and there's nothing wrong with that--it can be quite counter productive to be so certain of things when you do not take the time to understand the theories that you are trying to refute:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Isaac Einstein View Post
By the way, gravity IS infinite ----- but obviously stronger, nearer 'source'.
If gravity were infinite then you could not possibly be here now. The "source" of the gravity on earth is the geometric center of the (imperfectly shaped) sphere of the earth. If gravity were "infinite" at that point it would be by definition more powerful than any known black hole, which would of course cause the earth to collapse into a tiny point.

Obviously that hasn't happened, therefore gravity cannot be "infinite" at its "source."

It does not really take much "research" or even education to begin to work through these kinds of logic problems, and learning how to do so is quite essential to do anything resembling "science."

Unfortunately if you do not make that effort, it becomes difficult to take your theories seriously, especially if you don't provide data beyond stating that you "know its true."

We certainly encourage people to learn about science--no matter how old they are--but its important to approach it with an open mind.

Wisdom is what's left after we've run out of personal opinions,
Buffy


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Old 10-06-2009   #313 (permalink)
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Re: Perpetual motion

Buffy,
Who on Earth, is going to place their magnets so close, that they cause 'drag'?
In answer to your latter arguement, I'm affraid you've got it all WRONG! What I
meant was, gravity (as experienced on the SURFACE of the EARTH), reaches out
forever ----- albeit, gradualy diminishing. I did NOT mention anything about 'BLACK
HOLES' forming at the center of the Earth!
Read the book ----- not the cover!

Sir Isaac Einstein
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Old 10-06-2009   #314 (permalink)
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Re: Perpetual motion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Isaac Einstein View Post
Buffy,
Who on Earth, is going to place their magnets so close, that they cause 'drag'?
In answer to your latter arguement, I'm affraid you've got it all WRONG! What I
meant was, gravity (as experienced on the SURFACE of the EARTH), reaches out
forever ----- albeit, gradualy diminishing. I did NOT mention anything about 'BLACK
HOLES' forming at the center of the Earth!
Read the book ----- not the cover!

Sir Isaac Einstein
Hey! If Buffy wants to place magnets so close that they cause drag, I for one will defend her right to do so.

--lemit


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Old 10-06-2009   #315 (permalink)
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Re: Perpetual motion

Carefull Lemit,
Buffy just might kick you, and you'd turn into dust.
Read the book, and not the cover.

Sir Isaac Einstein
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Old 10-06-2009   #316 (permalink)
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Re: Perpetual motion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Isaac Einstein View Post
I'm quite sure, that anyone constructing a 'perpetual motion machine' ----- using magnets ----- would
not place their magnets so far away, that they become ineffective.
By the way, gravity IS infinite ----- but obviously stronger, nearer 'source'.
Sir Isaac Einstein
Let's see if we can start over on this.

By the way, it is a safe bet that the phrase "is infinite" is ALWAYS wrong, no matter how it is used. So, we can say that the force of gravity never reaches zero as the distance from the body is increased. That avoids using the word "infinite" entirely, which is generally a good thing.

Now, as to magnets and distances. A magnet can indeed have a "work function" without the input of energy. That just means that the magnet can move (exert a force upon) a metal object, over a non-zero distance. Work = force X distance. No input of energy is required for this one-shot deal.

But distance must end somewhere, and it ends at the magnet. Once the object contacts the magnet, the object is not going anywhere else (unless someone inputs energy and pulls the object away). So, you can get a little bit of work out of a magnet. But just once. For a "Perpetual Motion" machine, you would need a continuous supply of work. You need the magnet to pull on a metal object (or multiple objects) over and over and over again in a completely repeatable fashion, so the System can get an unbounded amount of work out of the magnet(s).

But you can't do that. Either the objects stick to the magnets (end of work, no more free ride), or you have to have an external supply of energy (or momentum) to pull the objects away from the magnets and return them to their starting point(s).

Now, you could say (just for example), No, my system is different, because these magnets travel these really complicated paths, and they slide back and forth, and the whole thing is mounted on several nested wheels, and gravity is always there to make these forces when I need them, and on and on and on...

But you can't make the problem go away by covering it up with complexity.


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Last edited by Pyrotex; 10-06-2009 at 02:27 PM..
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Old 3 Weeks Ago   #317 (permalink)
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Re: Perpetual motion

perhaps such is real, just an issue of discovering it. Ive been working on free energy projects for years, if your interested in seeing some of my schematics check out my site at *LINK REMOVED*

Last edited by CraigD; 3 Weeks Ago at 03:46 PM.. Reason: Removed spam link
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