Terra Preta - The parent thread which started it all

[davidgmills]

Taildragerdriver:

What is the humidity where you live? Even though you do not have much rainfall the humidity might be higher than expected for such an otherwise dry climate.

I ask this question because, my very first observation was that the charcoal in the ground almost seemed to have sucked water out of the air. I don't remember any appreciable rainfall rainfall to cause this and the surrounding ground seemed dry in comparison. So you may be pleasantly surprised to find that it really does help stop wind as well as rain erosion.

Does anyone know just how well charcoal will absorb/adsorb (I guess adsorb seems to be the more appropriate term) water from the ambient air?

Also, on another site I read today that a presentation at the 18th International Soil Covention indicated that glucose would jump start the bacterial process. If so, it would be nice to know how much sugar water would be a good idea on a square foot of ground.

[Taildragerdriver]

David:

We have very low humidity here especially in the summer. It is not uncommon to humidity less than 10% during mid day in the summer.

I do believe one of the positive elements of charcoal will be to reduce the need for irrigation and as you noted if we do try it in a row crop application it seems likely this may be an important part of keeping it from blowing away.

I think we might try it pretty quickly in our corn patch and see what happens.

Thanks

[maikeru]

Originally Posted by davidgmills

As far as buying it though, at least for now, for us urbanites and suburbanites, I am afraid we are doomed to buy BBQ charcoal for now. Heck, I could not even find a place that had lump charcoal. I had to buy briquettes. Walmart sells lump. But they were out. And I am sure it will be considerably more expensive. But I want to try lump if I can find it.

I have tried BBQ briquettes, but there are some issues with them. First, they may contain traces of harmful metals or chemicals, since the charcoal is made from coal and industrial byproducts; you wouldn't want to put those in the ground. Second, they are much harder to fragment and powder than lump charcoal. If you can, hold out for the lump wood charcoal. That's what I eventually used in all my pots. I made my powder by putting the lumps into a burlap bag, wetting it (to reduce the dust), and jumping on it. It's an inefficient method, and certainly not feasible for large-scale powder charcoal production, but it was enough to test in my pots. I got 10 lbs of lump charcoal from Wal-Mart for about $5. Not too bad.

[erich]

In E. O. Wilson's "The Future of Life" he opens the book with a letter to Thoreau updating him on our current understanding of the nature of the ecology of the soils at Walden Pond.


" These arthropods are the giants of the microcosm (if you will allow me to continue what has turned into a short lecture). Creatures their size are present in dozens-hundreds, if an ant or termite colony is presents. But these are comparatively trivial numbers. If you focus down by a power of ten in size, enough to pick out animals barely visible to the naked eye, the numbers jump to thousands. Nematode and enchytraied pot worms, mites, springtails, pauropods, diplurans, symphylans, and tardigrades seethe in the underground. Scattered out on a white ground cloth, each crawling speck becomes a full-blown animal. Together they are far more striking and divers in appearance than snakes, mice, sparrows, and all the other vertebrates hereabouts combined. Their home is a labyrinth of miniature caves and walls of rotting vegetable debris cross-strung with ten yards of fungal threads. And they are just the surface of the fauna and flora at our feet. Keep going, keep magnifying until the eye penetrates microscopic water films on grains of sand, and there you will find ten billion bacteria in a thimbleful of soil and frass. You will have reached the energy base of the decomposer world as we understand it 150 years after you sojourn in Walden Woods."



Certainly there remains much work to just characterize all the estimated 1000 species of microbes found in a pinch of soil, and Wilson concludes at the end of the prolog that
"Now it is up to us to summon a more encompassing wisdom."

I wonder what the soil biome was REALLY like before the cutting and charcoaling of the virgin east coast forest, my guess is that now we see a severely diminished community, and that only very recent Ag practices like no-till have helped to rebuild it.

I think I found this link in this forum some where:
First-ever estimate of total bacteria on earth
ET 9/98: First-ever estimate of total bacteria on earth

[erich]

I spoke with the author of a Terra Preta (TP) story in Solar Today, Ron Larson ,

http://www.solartoday.org/2006/nov_d...CornerND06.pdf


he said he spoke with a major National Geographic editor, who is preparing a big article on TP. but Doesn't know when it will be out.

[Michaelangelica]

Originally Posted by erich

I spoke with the author of a Terra Preta (TP) story in Solar Today, Ron Larson ,
http://www.solartoday.org/2006/nov_d...CornerND06.pdf
he said he spoke with a major National Geographic editor, who is preparing a big article on TP. but Doesn't know when it will be out.

Erich at large:-
Terra Preta Soils to Save the Biosphere :: The Environment Site Forum

(Pls post it here too so we have one cenrtal data base???)

[Taildragerdriver]

I measured the Wigwam Burner this weekend and it is 75 feet in diameter. Still seems real big.

I have talked to several people in the local community and there is a lot of interest in the concept so I may have help testing these ideas out. One of the great things about living in a real small place is that people are used to working together because it is the only way we can get things done.

I had not though about how the charcoal could absorb water. I think I will get it wet before I transport it. I have been concerned about how a manuer spreader would work with a powery substance. I think getting it wet will work much better.

I'm working on contacting university soil scientists and getting feedback on the concepts we are planning on using here. I will keep the forum posted as I get replies.

Thanks

Taildragerdriver

[erich]

A writer/Bio-Dynamic farmer contacted me about my postings on TP.
His interest in TP for his own operations, and his persistent will , has lead to him being granted an interview with none other than Charles C. Mann , author of "1491".

He is writing the story for Acres USA
Acres U.S.A. -- A Voice for Eco-Agriculture

[justforfun]

QUOTE=Michaelangelica;99726]This is a very good article on terra preta soils " saving soil as well as the planet" an amazing article with a lot of implications for climate control, global warming as well as agriculture
Saving The Planet While Saving The Farm: How soil carbonization could save the planet while it makes farming profitable again

That was indeed an excellent article. I think the major flaw in his theory is getting millions of farmers to 'jump on the charcoal bandwagon.' But for gardens everywhere it is a good idea. I am wondering if ashes from normal campfires would be a good soil additive...

[erich]

Here are some Questions and Suggestions I sent to Allan Balliett for his interview with Charles C. Mann


Questions:
1. Is Mr. Mann aware of Danny Day's Eprida work, that they are a social purpose firm, designing equipment and a business model that will not cost the farmer anything out of pocket and create a many fold increase in rural high pay employment.

And this commercial , larger industrial scale effort of a similar closed-loop pyrolysis system now on the market:
BEST Pyrolysis, Inc. | Slow Pyrolysis - Biomass - Clean Energy - Renewable Energy - Char - green coal - pelletized fuel - syngas for electrical generation - carbon credits - increases rural jobs and construction development


2. Given that, as Lehmann at Cornell points out, "systems such as Day's are the only way to make a fuel that is actually carbon negative". and that " a strategy combining biochar with biofuels could ultimately offset 9.5 billion tons of carbon per year-an amount equal to the total current fossil fuel emissions! "

What does Mr Mann suggest to implement the grand convergence we need for this technology to be brought front and center?:

In academia; among Engineers, agronomist, soil geologist,anthropologist, bio-chemist, mycologist, andzoologist ..............................?

In the Public sector; among waste managers, Extension agents, Environmental engineers, and Energy Policy makers,........................................?

In the private Sector; among corporate farms, fossil fuel producers, fossil fuel power generators, small farmers, and the few charcoal makers left.........................?



3. Does Mr. Mann know of any updated estimates of the total mass of soil flora and fauna?

This is the only one I have found , from 1998, only covering bacteria and is inclusive of marine sediments:

First-ever estimate of total bacteria on earth
ET 9/98: First-ever estimate of total bacteria on earth



SUGGESTIONS:

In E. O. Wilson's "The Future of Life" he opens the book with a letter to Thoreau updating him on our current understanding of the nature of the ecology of the soils at Walden Pond.

xvi / Prologue
" These arthropods are the giants of the microcosm (if you will allow me to continue what has turned into a short lecture). Creatures their size are present in dozens-hundreds, if an ant or termite colony is presents. But these are comparatively trivial numbers. If you focus down by a power of ten in size, enough to pick out animals barely visible to the naked eye, the numbers jump to thousands. Nematode and enchytraied pot worms, mites, springtails, pauropods, diplurans, symphylans, and tardigrades seethe in the underground. Scattered out on a white ground cloth, each crawling speck becomes a full-blown animal. Together they are far more striking and divers in appearance than snakes, mice, sparrows, and all the other vertebrates hereabouts combined. Their home is a labyrinth of miniature caves and walls of rotting vegetable debris cross-strung with ten yards of fungal threads. And they are just the surface of the fauna and flora at our feet. Keep going, keep magnifying until the eye penetrates microscopic water films on grains of sand, and there you will find ten billion bacteria in a thimbleful of soil and frass. You will have reached the energy base of the decomposer world as we understand it 150 years after you sojourn in Walden Woods."

This microcosm needs to be shown to the public. I suggest that Mr. Mann use his influence to convince an ecologically-minded Hollywood mogul to produce a DVD to add to his book jacket. A computer-generated film highlighting this dynamic ecology like those done of the flora and fauna of the Jurassic and Ice Age periods that you may have seen on the Science channels.
Here is an example that gives a great perspective on the scale of things, although not a video, but you get my point :
Molecular Expressions: Science, Optics and You - Secret Worlds: The Universe Within - Interactive Java Tutorial



GOOD LUCK with the interview!!

Erich