wild and crazy idea

[Thunderbird]

Originally Posted by nutronjon

Thanks John and Alexander. Alexander by spirnt did you mean the company Sprint the cell phone company. Sorry, I love technology, but I am poor and don't go looking for stuff I can not afford. Man, I wish I could afford the bus and technology and then could do my own thing without help. I would use a Monaco bus with solar power.

I figure if we had the communication system of the military, that bus would make news just for the technology on board.

UncleAl, I watched two environmental shows last night, and I am far more concerned about the destruction to the plant that we are causing, then any foriegn enemies. One show claimed we have consumed so much fish and our polution has killed so many more, that ocean is releasing methane gas and causing global warming that is so serious, the animals of Africa and the antartic are threatened with extinction. That means our own chances of survival are getting pretty bad. The old conscious of conquest and conquer is from the dark ages, and we do need a new way of thinking. We need to pick up the awareness of the civilizations we destroyed, and start working to save this planet. It would be nice if the peace bus had the ability to play a video about how we must live simply if we are going to save our planet the real enemy- ourselves. We need to redirect our attention to what we are doing to this planet and how we must do things differently so our young can enjoy we took for granted.

Our technology, means we can be the best informed people in history, and we need to act on that possibility. We need to enlighten the masses with truth, knowledge of how we are destroying our planet and how we can turn it into an Eden. We need to end the darkness.

I thought you might like this article I just ran across today,..Enjoy

Numinosity

Numinosity is the relationship between other people, places, and things and the individual. This concept seems to be the combination of the words numen and numinous. Numen* is defined as a spiritual force or influence that is often identified with a natural place, phenomenon, or object. Whereas numinous* is described as supernatural and mysterious; filled with a sense of the presence of divinity (holy); appealing to the higher emotions or the aesthetic sense (spiritual). Therefore, after an objects or things have acquired, or been given, an emotional or spiritual force they have obtained numinosity toward the individual or people. (*From Merriam-Webster's Collegiate Dictionary/Thesaurus [computer program])
Without numinosity things and other persons remain mere images to the individual because there is no psychic energy exchanged; that is, the individual feel no emotional attachment. The lack of numinosity in many lives of contemporary society is the result of the scientific understanding of things. Currently most things, including people, are described in scientific terms, which have dehumanized the individual.
One of the products of this dehumanization process has been the elimination of connections, particularly instinctual connections, between persons and things. A majority of the civilized world has started regarding things, even animals and plants, as possessions or objects. Little, if any, thought or feeling is given to the existence of these things or objects. This feeling of carelessness has become so persuasive that it has spilt over into man's relationships with his fellow human beings.
Although many feel they have lost something within their lives, they do not know the exact nature of their lost. Increasingly more people are recognizing that they are losing spirituality in their lives, and this is the reason for their dehumanization. Their recognition was not aided by their orthodox spiritual leaders, those who were more interested in maintaining their institutions than the sacred meaning that they stood for, but by probing deeply within themselves with the help of others who also came to this recognition.
Their probing not only centered on themselves but also on their ancient history. For some their search for what they had lost within their lives lead into the history and ways of their ancestors; ways that many had been told were wrong or evil. It was discovered ancient people did not think of the earth just as dried, inhuman matter, but as a living entity that they respected and called Mother Earth. For the ancient people Earth was their mother, whom they were emotionally attached to. The people knew she took care of them and they took care of her. They felt that they came from her and called her Mother Nature. Mother nature was not just an image then as she is to many in our current world. No, she was spoken to and revered just as a human mother would be. And, some even called her Mother "http://www.themystica.com/mystica/articles/g/goddess_3_the_mother.html".
In ancient, and more recent, times Earth was thought of and identified as a spiritual entity. Everything was believed to have come from this entity, which was worshiped as the Divine, or the Divine principle. This principle was within everything that it had created or bore, which included the universe, earth, and all things within. Early people felt no isolation from the cosmos as many feel today; no, they felt emotionally tied to the cosmos and everything within. Their existence as well as the existence of the universe, earth, and everything within was considered sacred because it all had come from the Divine.
It is thought this Divine spirit was called mother at first, then later father, but to those truly worshipping this spirit gender made little difference; they were worshipping the Creator spirit with whom they inclusive. This was a time when the sound of thunder was a voice of an angry god, and a bolt of lightening his missile; rivers contained spirits as did forests and meadows; trees were the life principle of man; the snake was the embodiment of wisdom; a mountain cave might be the home of a great demon, and people thought of stones, plants and animals as living things from which they heard voices talking to them.




Many think such times of enchantments are gone forever, and the sad part is that many do not care. They apparently seem satisfied with their scientific and sophisticated attitudes. Many classify and explain everything in cold calculated terms and feel mastery within their separate selves. Still, at times, they seem to question what is wrong with the world.
Others who have studied the ancient ways and helped to give birth to them again will gladly tell these people what the wrong is. They would tell them that the world is still mystical. The people who have returned to, or revived, the ancient ways would say that there is still a strong, emotional bound between Nature and her children. These people have rediscovered the sacred rituals, secret formulas, and many others things that once came out of the primeval forest to give life to the world. Simply, when mystical ties compose is the numinosity between the world, its parts, and the individual, all things become inclusive and alive. A.G.H.

Numinosity

[alexander]

Thunderbird, can you please post a reference to the original source?

Thank you

[nutronjon]

Thunderbird, exactly. There are real reasons for these different concepts of God. Those who believed God was the mother, lived in gentle environments where live was easy. The terrorifying sky god comes from the north, as the Mongols came from a region that is very unfriendly to humans, not enough farm soil to develop an agragarian culture, so people are nomadic hunters, in a region where lightening and snow storms can kill people.

Genghis Khan was quit sure humans survived despite this God who just assume humans did, and he thought the idea of a God who takes care of people, the most ridiculus thing he heard. He loved making a joke of the Christian God. When people refused to pay him tribute, he would send back a messaging saying "let the well of God be done" and the Mongols proceeded to kill every man, woman and child. Unfortunately, the Christians were trapped by their religious belief and accepted as fact that God was sending the Mongols to punish them for their sins, making them even more incapable to defending themselves.

How sad that the evil God dominated over the good Goddess is no longer part of our consciousness. This happened long before modern technology, and brings us to why Obama's preacher said "Damn America". Christianity is such a paradoxical religion! Jesus opposed Rome and we can find many things in the bible that say governments are worldly and evil. Obama's preacher made a good case for opposing this worldly force, and so do other demoninations.

I think this is coming back to the original concept of this thread. Those we put in the seats of power, become corrupted by that power, and too often this leads to war. The history of the US begins with opposition to this power. The forefathers deliberately made it difficult for the US to go to war, and the put the power to control what is spent on war, in the hands of congress to prevent a Bush and Cheney seizure of our armed forces. Our government has become separate from the people, just as the governments we call evil are separate from the people. The Internet can unite us, and the people's take over of the media is exciting.

A rise in spirituality would improve the condition for humanity, and this means the death of a male dominated religion that has killed our spirituality, or realizing Christianity is not a new religion, as long as it is tied to the old testament and the power of kings, who had the God given right to own slaves. Obama's preacher was right, but because he is a Christian preacher, he can only be half right.

[Thunderbird]

Did you catch the Bill Moyers interview with Rev Wright ? I think I would attend his church.
To bad the mainstream media likes playing the sound bite gothcha game playing to peoples short attention spans and knee jerk reactions.

I'm curious to see how many hits this interview will get on line.

[nutronjon]

Originally Posted by Thunderbird

Did you catch the Bill Moyers interview with Rev Wright ? I think I would attend his church.
To bad the mainstream media likes playing the sound bite gothcha game playing to peoples short attention spans and knee jerk reactions.

I'm curious to see how many hits this interview will get on line.

Man, things have gotten so out of control, and it is soooo frustrating to not be able to speak face to face with those running the show and totally blowing it.

Christianity is a religion of rebellion, and many churches speak of the evil of government. If Rev Wright's words were held in context there would not be a problem, but his own racism has surfaced like a screaming banshee, and this could be the death of Obama's political ambtions.

We need someone who knows more about the different churches than I do, to stress all the things said in church about the nature of evil government. I hate the feeling of helplessness I have right now.

[UncleAl]

Yahweh is singularly disinterested in human suffering other than to inflict it. In the whole of human history across the entire planet not one deity has volunteered Novocain. It is a telling omission. Civilization is the alternative to gods' dominion of poverty, hunger, disease, filth, death, and silk-clad priests with whips. Hindus have 36 crores of gods - 360 million deities. How is India doing?

(physical reality) - (empirical reality) = faith

Faith is destroyed if it works. If you have faith you can only be denied. Test of faith! The whole argument is moot in any case. At any gven moment the Earth is exactly 666 years old. Everything else is the work of the Devil. Anybody who says otherwise is thereby proven unqualified to comment.

[Boerseun]

...hang on a second...

You propose to stop the bombing of Iran by showing a bunch of Bible-thumpers the Internet?

What makes you think that they don't have the internet to begin with?
And what would be your choice of websites to show them?

Remember, for every anti-war website you'd care to mention, any hillbilly with a Bible and a laptop can find ten pro-KKK, pro-warfare, pro-white supremacy, pro-hate, pro-whatever-you-care-to-mention site.

Maybe you should show them some porn sites.

Their excitement over finally seeing the forbidden fruit might take their minds off warfare long enough to end the madness.

Or maybe GW will then simply bomb Iran with a dildo.

You never know.

But I personally think you'd be wasting your time in pursuing this particular venture.

[nutronjon]

Originally Posted by Boerseun

...hang on a second...

You propose to stop the bombing of Iran by showing a bunch of Bible-thumpers the Internet?

What makes you think that they don't have the internet to begin with?
And what would be your choice of websites to show them?

Remember, for every anti-war website you'd care to mention, any hillbilly with a Bible and a laptop can find ten pro-KKK, pro-warfare, pro-white supremacy, pro-hate, pro-whatever-you-care-to-mention site.

Maybe you should show them some porn sites.

Their excitement over finally seeing the forbidden fruit might take their minds off warfare long enough to end the madness.

Or maybe GW will then simply bomb Iran with a dildo.

You never know.

But I personally think you'd be wasting your time in pursuing this particular venture.

An excellent question. I would like help choosing those sites. For sure I would use

Welcome to the Project for the New American Century

I think with the price of gasoline skyrocketing, our need to control oil is better understood, but information about how oil backed the value of the dollar, and relates to our economy, would be helpful. And on this subject, any efforts to reduce the price of oil, that are other than reducing the use of it, are political promises that should not be made!

The site explaining the military theory behind Shock and Awe and the mess we are in is a good.

It might be helpful to work with what Rev. Wright said. To win an argument it is a good idea to get on the side of the opponent and walk the opponent through their reasoning to the reasoning you want them to have. Jesus was a rebel and he opposed Rome. We can work with this. It is not the people making war on people around the world, but their governments that make war.

We have to get our heads around globalization and the price of corn and then rice doubling, and why the US is hated, and the teachings of Jesus and Mohammed that manifest a different reality. We must come to understanding how our lust and gluttonous ways are hurting the world. I trust good Christians care as much as Muslims care, but they have been left ignorant of how their lives effect the lives of those around the world.