Creationism--Proof ?

[questor]

Damocles, congratulations on your treatise in logic. i can now understand why we have trouble communicating.

[TRoutMac]

Originally Posted by questor

Mac, if after reading my post, which you quote, you have arrived at these conclusions, i must admit to an inability to communicate, since you clearly misunderstand what i have written.

My apologies, questor, if I've misunderstood.

[goliah]

COMPLETELY UNEXPECTED. A real monkey wrench is about to hit both sides in the ID vs Evolution debate and particularly religion is in for difficult times. For a wholly new interpretation of the teachings of Christ, contained within the first ever religious claim and proof that meets all the criteria of the most rigorous, evidential, testable scientific method, is published and circulating on the web. It is titled The Final Freedoms. An intellectual, religious and political bombshell!

It is described by a single Law and moral principle, offering its own proof, one in which the reality of God confirms and responds to an act of perfect faith, by a direct intervention into the natural world, delivering a correction to human nature, including a change in natural law [biology], consciousness and human ethical perception [proof of the soul], providing new, primary insight and understanding of the human condition!

So while proponents of ID may have got the God part right, if this development demonstrates itself to be what it claims, and the means exist to do so, all religious teaching, tradition and understanding of ID are wholly in error, while the proponents of evolution who have rightly used that conception to beat down the credibility of religious tradition, but who have also used it to deny the potential for God, are in for a very rude shock.

However improbable, what history and theology have presumed to be impossible is now all too achievable. The implications defy imagination! No joke, no hoax and not spam.

Review copies of the manuscript prior to paper publication, are a free pdf download from a number of sites including: www.energon.uklinux.net and http://thefinalfreedoms.bulldoghome.com

[Biochemist]

Originally Posted by goliah

COMPLETELY UNEXPECTED. A real monkey wrench is about to hit both sides in the ID vs Evolution debate...

Welcome to the site, Goliah.

This bit of an odd document, but I think you might want to start a new thread if the topic is of interest to you. This is a bit of a divergence from the original topic of this thread.

FYI, the conflict is not really between ID and evolution, although that is popularly represented. The conflict is between ID and Naturalism, as two opposing views of the same data. ID incorporates and includes most elements of evolution. Michael Behe (one of the original ID proponents) regards the ID point of view as an addition to evolution, not a rejection of it.

[cosmo]

Originally Posted by questor

why should anyone attack me for asking simple questions? attacks usually originate from persons with an agenda opposite to the one proposed. the fact is that you don't believe in creation although you cannot defend that position scientifically. the truth also is that the politically correct movement and the ACLU are trying to drive religion out of our society, when the very laws and societal mores we live by were founded on these principles. the result will be a poorer society rather than a better one, with fewer curbs on bad behavior.
the word science derives from the Latin word meaning ; to know. i am not playing
semantical games here, i am saying neither you nor i know the origin of the universe, you're taking the non-creational position with no facts to back it up, i'm assuming there is a
possibility of a creator, and the evidence i see points in that direction.

I agree with you. No one on the face of this planet can give any evidence at all of there not being a creator. But, there is infinite evidence to prove the existance of a creator and the evidence is all around you. I'll never forget these words I heard in a speech by Dr. Hugh Ross that he made back in 1994. He said, "Everything that is created must have a creator," thus proving the existance of God. The evidence is the universe. It wasn't some accident that happened once upon a time, it was created. Albert Einstein said that the creation of the universe or the "Big Bang" theory he believed in must have happened through means of a greater intelligence far beyond that of any human. He was talking about God.

The speech that Dr. Hugh Ross made back in 1994 about God and the universe can be wread and listened to here: http://www.cosmicfingerprints.com/audio/newevidence.htm

I encourage everyone to listen to this. Trust me, its something you really don't want to miss.

[ughaibu]

The proof of christian creation is anal hair in human males. The proof depends on the assumption that the Bible is reliable on two points, 1) that God created man in his image and 2) that God is all-powerful. As the Bible is the word of God we can throw out any doubts about it's reliability, any problems of logic arising from it being the word of God about God are overruled by the fact that it is God.
We know that anal hair in human males is not an evolutionary development because it's such an inconvenience, further, humans are the only animals requiring artificial aids (paper, sprays, buckets, etc) in order to avoid a mass of smelly and matted hairs. The Bible is specific in stating that 'man' was created in the image, the sample of women so far tested has proven them bereft of anal hair, pointing to the significance of this feature for those seeking meaning in the details of the image. We can easily demonstrate from God's all-powerfulness the absurdity of him saying "I'm famished, one of you cherubs nip down to the chippy and get me a creation and creation pie", or God shouting from inside the toilet "which one of you idiots didn't replace the paper again!". In short, God neither eats nor defecates so is not inconvenienced by his own anal hair. So, there you have it, interestingly we can see God's sense of humour in leaving this rather obvious clue.
"Aha!" some of you might say, "but what if the image refered to in the Bible is functional, not one of physical form?" and you would have a point. We then have to consider pogonophora which as animals that neither eat nor defecate, could be considered to be created in the functional likeness. Interestingly pogonophora live way down in the depths where it's very hot and smells of sulphur, unavoidably bringing the other camp to mind. This leads us on to the further idea that the God/Devil divide is less one of good and evil than one of form and function. As the Bible represents form and evolution represents function we are confirmed in our initial assumption that the Bible is of divine origin and therefore reliable.

[Southtown]

What a load of sh*t.

[tarak]

[rather than a better one, with fewer curbs on bad behavior.
the word science derives from the Latin word meaning ; to know. i am not playing

Science and theology are two streams/schools of perpendicularly aligned logic, reasoned out by mankind, to program his sustenance in different enviroments.
The movement you say proof; you are entering the domain of science. In the domain of theology and god there is only belief and there is no need to prove anything to anybody.
You believe or you don't??
When you say intelligent creation and proof ;you are looking at god from the age of reason and scienitific method and opens up cans full of worms.
Whether your creator was my creator??Who created the creator??If creator was created whether he would be a creator??What did creator create??Whether the viewpoint of human being is the standard vis-a-vis other wonderful creations of the creator???and so on...

[Pyrotex]

Originally Posted by ughaibu

The proof of christian creation is anal hair in human males. ...

Well, actually, this is a good post.
Some don't like it because it is non-traditional, I admit.
And some criticize it because the conclusion it purports to prove is not a common issue or concern in fundementalist or pentacostal circles.
But the logic, the LOGIC! --- is pure Pat Robertson! Perfect!!!!