[arkain101]

This topic is about increasing our perceptions of reality, while including the well known debate of Evolution versus Intelligent design or creation aswell. But before you say not another one, I mean to point out firstly it is a new and different approach.

http://www.cosmicfingerprints.com/ifyoucanreadthis.htm is something I came across that I found quite interesting. Not only because it (the audio lecture) was very clearly explained with open mindedness, but also because the approach using basic principles. I have mentioned this concept before in other topics as some may have noticed. The basic principles, designed for positive intent with productive results, and I've been refering to this as truth-basic mannerism.

In this lecture, Perry Marshall, the speaker, makes some very clear points on some very basic principles. He does throw in his own opinion, but with or without it, the points still stand as basic potential truths.

I encourage you to listen in, or get what you can from the summery for interest sake and for possible future discussion in this topic.

I plan for this topic to be a purpose intended discussion to find facts and answers towards questions of our reality, and to try and avoid the purpose to become related to defending, proving, or disproving a particular theory, and strive for the purpose of pointing out logistic facts in relation to our existence and the universe and how it is that it is here.

So enjoy the audio for the time being and I will get to work on some of my own information to share.

The result is not to have a winning side but to empower our perceptions.

[Boerseun]

Arkain, I'll have to say "Oh hell - not again."

I followed the link, and nothing new was forthcoming, except the rock-hard belief in the common fallacy that information 'can't be generated naturally'.

The 'code' in our DNA is the result of a feedback loop, that has only one requirement: The ability to procreate and live in a given environment.

I have written a spreadsheet to generate random letters, picking those that 'fit' the environment, and leaving the rest.

Here's the output: (Underscore is SPACE)

Q
D
W
C
F
Q
F
K
O
P
B
Z
D
V
P
R
Y
V
O
M
N
N
R
_
D
J
_
Q
F
X
R
F
W
U
A
_
D
A
Z
P
A
Q
Z
J
V
B
V
S
D
A
L
Z
F
O
Q
J
J
I
G
S
D
A
A
M
D
G
T
X
U
T
J
S
D
A
J
W
G
J
A
V
U
C
A
S
D
A
Y
W
X
J
R
H
U
Y
B
S
D
A
F
W
M
R
O
F
U
I
B
S
D
A
M
W
J
Q
Y
H
U
J
V
S
D
A
_
W
T
B
T
E
U
H
H
S
D
A
K
W
Y
G
N
W
U
Z
E
S
D
A
H
W
Q
A
X
R
U
S
E
S
D
A
I
W
X
J
U
R
U
W
E
S
D
A
A
W
Z
G
S
R
U
D
E
S
D
A
E
W
T
Y
I
R
U
O
E
S
D
A
M
W
X
H
D
R
U
P
E
S
D
A
R
W
E
U
L
R
U
D
E
S
D
A
R
W
O
W
E
R
U
_
E
S
D
A
R
W
C
J
U
R
U
W
E
S
D
A
R
W
L
Z
G
R
U
F
E
S
D
A
R
W
G
_
N
R
U
I
E
S
D
A
R
W
P
W
X
R
U
_
E
S
D
A
R
W
X
D
K
R
U
B
E
S
D
A
R
W
T
F
P
R
U
P
E
S
D
A
R
W
K
O
E
R
U
E
E
S
D
A
R
W
D
N
K
R
U
H
E
S
D
A
R
W
X
N
T
R
U
W
E
S
D
A
R
W
Z
N
_
R
U
J
E
S
D
A
R
W
J
N
_
R
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E
S
D
A
R
W
I
N
_
R
U
X
E
S
D
A
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W
I
N
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R
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D
A
R
W
I
N
_
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T
E
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D
A
R
W
I
N
_
R
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K
E
S
D
A
R
W
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N
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U
R
E
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D
A
R
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I
N
_
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V
E
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D
A
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I
N
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B
E
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D
A
R
W
I
N
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R
U
L
E
S

This have created the sentence "DARWIN RULES" in only 39 'generations', using an environmental feedback loop.

Nature seems to be able to generate information. The environment decides what works, and what doesn't, granting those that do the opportunity to procreate, and discarding the rest.

[Boerseun]

Shit - how do I get it in tab format??!?!?!

[arkain101]

This have created the sentence "DARWIN RULES" in only 39 'generations', using an environmental feedback loop.

Nature seems to be able to generate information. The environment decides what works, and what doesn't, granting those that do the opportunity to procreate, and discarding the rest.

I assume what you were showing didnt post properly. Could you enlighten me on what an envirmental feedback loop is?

I wonder..

[arkain101]

Lets look at the universe in a very fundamental manner.

Lets look at evolution.

Evolution in the theory sense on life, is a process that describes life forms starting from an original fundamental state and eventually mutating into a new form of itself that is better suited for things relavent to its survival. For example, we start with a bacteria. It eventually evolves into a bigger multi celled organism that can dominate over other single cell creatures to ensure its survival, and have better ability at moving around, for both fleeing and chasing down other forms of life. Or, A monkey for example that eventually grew the body shape that was better suited for walking on two legs and then mutating a more complex brain design for better problem solving.

This is evolution the theory in life, Darwin.

There is also the reference to evolution of the species without it changing into a better suited physical mutation (not mutation in a bad sense, mutation in evolution is equal to bettering its survival capabilities). This type of evolution relates to a species not changing but the evolution of the species in its behavioral way. We look at our human race for example. In the past 5000 years we are still physically more or less the same but we have evolved as a species to different knowledge, reality, consciousness, society, communication etc.

So when we are refering to something having evolved, we see where there is the different references to the statement, and possible chance for being misunderstood.

[arkain101]

DNA.

The statements Perry Marshall made about DNA are rather intriguing.

The scientist (s) who won the nobel prize for the study on DNA won it under the discription of Unlocking the DNA 'code'.

DNA is a code. It is a language, then language of life. I understand there is four different Letters in the DNA code alphabet. The 'letters' are molecules and there is four kinds. So in each code of your dna, these four letters spell out who you are in a symbolic form. The (M) Matter and (E) Energy that make up this DNA double Helix are organized in a language that symbolically (like words you are reading now are symbolic for meanings, and pictures, and sounds etc) spells out everything that you are. So we know that we are designed when we look at this fact. We start as a DNA strand that contains a huge comination of molecular code, that will draw who we are to become. The designer could be evolution, chaos, or what else have you. But, when we are born we will become what our design plans us to become.

[arkain101]

Connecting, Evolution, DNA, Language, and Design.

So what is evolution?

What happens at the fundemental parts of the life form. We understand that the life form is what it is from writing out a special Paragraph using the 4 letters in DNA code (these are Adenine, Thymine, Cytosine, and Guanine). Lets make these letters, A, H, O, P for a hypothetical situation.
Lets imagine that a Fish is spelled in DNA code like so.

"HOPA PAPA HOHO AHHH"

Now studies have be done that tried to manipulate the spelling in a life forms DNA structure from the use of radiation. They have tested on fruit flies, and other insects trying to re-spell something in the code that might cause the fly to develope into a new species, or develope some new function that would act benefical to it.

So if we use some technology to mess with the spelling for the fish to mutate its DNA, and try to cause it to evolve, we will change "HOPA PAPA HOHO AHHH" to something else like "HOPA PAHA HOHO AHHP" But it will not spell fish and it will not spell our a new species that seems capable to survive.

I have read that in no test or observation is there data that actually proves a mutation in the DNA of a life form can lead to a new species. Which is exactly what Evolution Theory is all about.

Now, acceptably, we can expect all evolution to be caused by mutation. We can assume that a lifeform evolved from adding to its dna code and not just altering it. This is thought to happen from need to survive. For example, a Creature needs to evade its enemies so it learns to run fast and developes dna alterations that give it longer stronger legs, eventually it learns to jump and its dna alters to grow some webbing between its limbs and body to glide from large leaps, then eventually it wants to keep gliding so its dna alterates for it to grow feathers so it can flap its webbings and make use of the Wing "lift" effect. And finally its dna alterates so that it becomes a bird and can avoid its enemies all together by hanging out in trees and soaring in the air.

Although, Studies have been done to see if the actions and intent a life-form performs throughout its life time will have any effect or alterations on its reproductive DNA and found no evidence any learned memories or intent could be passed through the DNA into the offspring of the life-form. To give you an example of one of these studies. Scientists used rats to practice mazes untill they had them very well memorized and capable of more quickly solving new mazes, and checked to see if it had any effect on the next generations, and on to the next generations and etc. No significant result of DNA re-coding was apparent.

I am not ruling out anything, I understand there could be more recent studies showing postitive results of DNA alterations, and would gladly like to have them added.

So everything that is life is blue printed, coded, or designed with an informational language from some kind of intent and reason, through its DNA.

But where did language, information, intent, come from?

Was the code a result of evolution, or was evolution the result from the code...

[Boerseun]

Hi there. Sorry about the last post, it was supposed to be in tab form, but came out linear instead.

What I did was take a random set of letters,
AFGTIFPTKINW
Then, I wrote a spreadsheet to randomly generate a new set.
This came out:
SERTUBPOGJRD
Working as evolution does, to keep what works (those that don't, simply die off) and our requirement to fit this imaginary 'niche' is the sentence "DARWIN RULES", it seems as if the third letter fits the bill. So now, we keep the 'R' and randomly generate the rest. And after only 39 "Generations", the full sentence appeared. I suppose I should run the experiment a few million times to get the average for generating the sentence that'll fit the 'niche', but this serves to illustrate.

Intelligent Design buffs will, of course, say that the outcome was pre-determined, and therefore 'designed' via 'intelligence'. That is not so. The only 'design' that could be inferred here, is the ability for the organism to suit that which is dictated by the environment, in this case, fitting the proper sentence.

Intelligent Design guys suffer from the fallacy of the enumeration of favourable circumstances. They look at nature and say that everything is as it should be because it was designed. The unfavourable examples they tend to ignore. Such as anaerobic bacteria that harkens back to a oxygen-free atmosphere. These little buggers are old, and predate even plants, those pesky bastards that poisoned the atmosphere with oxygen. The only reason they are still around is because there are indeed still niches left for them to invade, like certain human bodyparts that might suffer from such unmentionable and uncomfortable conditions like yeast infections.
Other examples is rabbits which were so stupidly designed that they have to eat their own feces in order to get any nourishment. Their guts are too short.

Nature is not perfect, not by any means. And organisms continuously evolve to better fit into the environment, while the environment itself keeps on changing. Long-lived animals like sharks, which have been around for hundreds of milions of years, doesn't point to a good design - it simply points to a very constant environment.
Dinosaurs, again, points to an environment that changed faster than evolution could keep up.

These guys trying to use information theory to prove intelligent design simply don't understand the issue at hand.

They are wrong.

Thus Boerseun spake.

[Racoon]

How the heck did the Platypus evolve?

are you saying that it isn't intelligent Design?
or was it dumb design by nature.

Platypuses are Gnarly Rad!

Couldn't nature "design" creatures in a manner that seems "intelligent" by our reasoning abilities?
oh, that would be evolution.

[arkain101]

What I did was take a random set of letters,
AFGTIFPTKINW
Then, I wrote a spreadsheet to randomly generate a new set.
This came out:
SERTUBPOGJRD
Working as evolution does, to keep what works (those that don't, simply die off) and our requirement to fit this imaginary 'niche' is the sentence "DARWIN RULES", it seems as if the third letter fits the bill. So now, we keep the 'R' and randomly generate the rest. And after only 39 "Generations", the full sentence appeared. I suppose I should run the experiment a few million times to get the average for generating the sentence that'll fit the 'niche', but this serves to illustrate.

So now, we keep the 'R' and randomly generate the rest.

I understand your point. Although it appears, at least to me, that you are the intelligent mind and designer behind this "random generater". If it has intent, it has intelligence. In other words, try spelling darwin rules, with complete random chaos. If your mind is involved or the program is 'designed' in such a way to accomplish something, a form of intelligence should be agreed to have pre existed the creation of your random generation, should it not?