Science and Religion

[Turtle]

Originally Posted by cwes99_03

IOW, faith is based on something.

Yep; it's called superstition.

[cwes99_03]

While faith is not based on superstition, superstition is a type of faith. The basis for the faith would determine if it was founded religiously or simply the philosophy of men (such as an urban legend).

[Turtle]

Originally Posted by cwes99_03

While faith is not based on superstition, superstition is a type of faith. The basis for the faith would determine if it was founded religiously or simply the philosophy of men (such as an urban legend).

BS Superstition is, as superstition does.

[Boerseun]

Originally Posted by cwes99_03

While faith is not based on superstition...

This is interesting. If faith is not based on superstition, in your view, what is it then based upon?

Religious folk believe in an out-of-body world that can only be accessed upon death. How exactly does this not qualify as superstition?

[Southtown]

Well, from wiki:

"A Superstition is the irrational belief that future events are influenced by specific behaviors, without having a causal relationship."

In which case, karma would not be superstitious. Judgement though would require intelligence rather than a simple chain of events.

[Turtle]

Originally Posted by Southtown

Well, from wiki:

"A Superstition is the irrational belief that future events are influenced by specific behaviors, without having a causal relationship."

In which case, karma would not be superstitious. Judgement though would require intelligence rather than a simple chain of events.

Then we have this definition:
su·per·sti·tion (spr-stshn)
n.
1. An irrational belief that an object, action, or circumstance not logically related to a course of events influences its outcome.
2.
a. A belief, practice, or rite irrationally maintained by ignorance of the laws of nature or by faith in magic or chance.
b. A fearful or abject state of mind resulting from such ignorance or irrationality.
c. Idolatry.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/superstition

And this one:
superstition


superstition


1 definition found

The Collaborative International Dictionary of English v.0.48 [gcide]:
Superstition \Su`per*sti"tion\, n. [F. superstition, L.
superstitio, originally, a standing still over or by a thing;
hence, amazement, wonder, dread, especially of the divine or
supernatural, fr. superstare to stand over; super over +
stare to stand. See Super-, and Stand.]
1. An excessive reverence for, or fear of, that which is
unknown or mysterious.
[1913 Webster]

2. An ignorant or irrational worship of the Supreme Deity;
excessive exactness or rigor in religious opinions or
practice; extreme and unnecessary scruples in the
observance of religious rites not commanded, or of points
of minor importance; also, a rite or practice proceeding
from excess of sculptures in religion.
[1913 Webster]

And the truth
With superstitions and traditions taint. --Milton.
[1913 Webster]

3. The worship of a false god or gods; false religion;
religious veneration for objects.
[1913 Webster]

[The accusers] had certain questions against him of
their own superstition. --Acts xxv.
19.
[1913 Webster]

4. Belief in the direct agency of superior powers in certain
extraordinary or singular events, or in magic, omens,
prognostics, or the like.
[1913 Webster]

5. Excessive nicety; scrupulous exactness.
[1913 Webster]

Syn: Fanaticism.

Usage: Superstition, Fanaticism. Superstition springs
from religious feeling misdirected or unenlightened.
Fanaticism arises from this same feeling in a state of
high-wrought and self-confident excitement. The former
leads in some cases to excessive rigor in religious
opinions or practice; in others, to unfounded belief
in extraordinary events or in charms, omens, and
prognostics, hence producing weak fears, or excessive
scrupulosity as to outward observances. The latter
gives rise to an utter disregard of reason under the
false assumption of enjoying a guidance directly
inspired. Fanaticism has a secondary sense as applied
to politics, etc., which corresponds to the primary.
[1913 Webster]

http://www.wordseek.info/word/gcide/superstition.html

All in all, the common theme is irrationality.

[Boerseun]

Superstition can also be described as the full set of human beliefs and religions, minus your own. For some reason, a superstitious person will never own up to the fact. So if you're a Muslim, everybody else is superstitious except you. And if you're a Christian, everybody else would be superstitious, except you.

Superstition is the belief in the unprovable. If something is unprovable, there is no causal link between it and the world around you.

Superstition does seem to generate a lot of money, however... can you see the propelling force behind religion? What gives the incentive to those preaching it...? What made it roll on for literally thousands of years?

Buffy wins the prize! It's called marketing. And if you have to put the fear of God into your client base (literally) to empty their pockets, so much better for the bottom line. Actually, that is your product... the Fear of God. Problem is, of course, if you have a winning product and sales formula, pretty soon the competition will rear its ugly head. And there we go. Now you know why we have religious fundamentalism in the world today. Marketing. Badabing badaboom. Sales reps slugging it out for the same market.

[Buffy]

Originally Posted by Boerseun

Buffy wins the prize! It's called marketing... Problem is, of course, if you have a winning product and sales formula, pretty soon the competition will rear its ugly head. And there we go. Now you know why we have religious fundamentalism in the world today. Marketing.

Tee hee! But of course some marketing cynics like to point out that all that persuasive stuff is just "used to justify decisions that were already made."

Its all about getting the base to turn out at the pews,
Buffy

[cwes99_03]

There are tons of superstitious people, who are aetheists.

1) a guy who always bets on a particular number at a roulette wheel or craps table, not because of odds, but because of luck.
2) a person who always repeats a certain task or set of tasks on a regular basis simply because they believe that there is something to that repitition that makes things better in their life, not because they understand how the repition of the task actually improves anything.
3) a person who repeatedly does anything, or observes anything without a reason for doing so (a person who votes because they believe their single vote counts even though they have repeated proof that no election they have ever voted in has ever been decided by a single vote)
4) a person who votes down party lines, even though certain members running for election in that party may not hold the same views as they do
5) a person who votes for someone thinking they are a better choice than the opposition, even though multiple people they have voted for in the past have turned out to be sexual predators, pedaphiles, hypocrites, drug addicts, adulterers, war mongers, blackmailers, bribe takers............
Who would like me to go on?
Superstition is not just belief in the unprovable. Superstition is the belief in something that you refuse to take a deeper examination of. Belief, as has already been stated, in the mysterious. Thus, people of any belief who have no firm understanding for why something happens, but choose to believe it all the same, are superstitious.
The following is for Turtle.
People who believe that God takes the lives of people because he works in mysterious ways, are a superstitious lot.

[Southtown]

Originally Posted by Boerseun

Superstition is the belief in the unprovable. If something is unprovable, there is no causal link between it and the world around you.

I don't think that's necessarily the case, generally speaking.

Originally Posted by Boerseun

Superstition does seem to generate a lot of money, however... can you see the propelling force behind religion? What gives the incentive to those preaching it...? What made it roll on for literally thousands of years?

Buffy wins the prize! It's called marketing. And if you have to put the fear of God into your client base (literally) to empty their pockets, so much better for the bottom line. Actually, that is your product... the Fear of God. Problem is, of course, if you have a winning product and sales formula, pretty soon the competition will rear its ugly head. And there we go. Now you know why we have religious fundamentalism in the world today. Marketing. Badabing badaboom. Sales reps slugging it out for the same market.

There's more to religion than you see on tv. I don't even go to church for instance. Neither do I attend study groups. I did allow the Jehovah's Witnesses to come in a while back, though, since my hobby is arguing. They don't come around much anymore.